Legal fuel?

[Skoontz]

Russ:

Try Shell premium, 91 octane. During early spring last year we passed with flying colors at the sectionals, and that is supposed to be the time when Shell has the woe is me hug a tree blend that tosses the meters off the scale.

Have you got any Chevrons around you? We mix 50% 110 VP octane, 50% Chevron regular, and Red Line oil at 25-1, passes with flying colors....Simple blend....

[hydroracer25]

"fuel of the day"

I have a question regarding this wonderful fuel situation and the almighty meter.

Last week we purchased ethanol free gas from BP/Amoco. I asked the station manager if he was certain that the fuel contained no ethanol. He assured me there was no ethanol in it. Guess what happened when we had our fuel tested? We finally found some fuel in the pits that passed the almighty meter (thanks Dianne & Pete) but were instructed to keep it in the shade as the meter will show it illegal if it gets to warm. We had some visitors there when this happened and they were very interested in the concept of "clamp on and go" racing. When they saw the fuel debacle and heard all the suggestions of "go to this airport and get av gas" and "go to the local speedway and find a race fuel dealer" they were instantly turned off with the idea of spending money on boat racing.

This is the J, AX, and KPro class. It shouldn't be so darn stressful trying to find gas so the kids can go have fun.

My question,....
What fuels can we run in Joey's OMC's without doing any damage?
Is there a maximum octane they will tolerate?
Which is better, AV gas or race fuel for the OMC's?
Am I the only one who's girdle does a wheelie over this darn fuel meter/ethanol B.S.?

Some one chime in if I'm wrong, but at all "local" races the inspector has the power to deem a "fuel of the day" by going to either the nearest or a local gas station picking a fuel and setting the meter to it (ie. if it reads +50 with blend of known TCW2 oil then anything below that is legal).

Because pure gasoline is very hard to find, we've used this method as have a lot of other local races.

This method can not be done at championship races (Divisional and National), and therefore you must have pure "legal" gasoline. Due to the fact that it is very hard to find legal gas, MHRA is getting VP gasoline delivered (by pre-order) to the SO/J Nationals to make it easier on teams.

Mark

[aojesus]

We have had to enact the "fuel of the day" rule several times in region 5 last season.
I don't think we were able to do this at Lakeland as it was a records course.

[stu_racing]

This has been a problem for many years. I remember about 7 years ago on the inboard circuit the problem reached it's pinnacle in our racing team. Dan brought 4, 4 gallon cans of gas and only one was legal. The VP race gas and 93 octane stuff was illegal, but the 87 octane was legal. We were told the 87octane was legal at one station, but illegal at 2 others. What it depended on, up in Canada, was that whether the winter gas had run dry from the tanks in comparison to other tanks.
It's a major problem, but as long as the digitron is used we're in trouble when it comes to this rule. It sucks since the original rule was meant so that only pump gas was used and no additional additives were used. You usually can smell addtives but have no proof without a tester.
Hopefully someone that is more educated on the issue can help the entire boat racing community out.

[Tomtall]

Make an even playing field

The fuel being run at races today in the "J" classes and Stock Outboard classes are all over the place as far as blends and additives. My feelings on the matter and I stress they are only MY fellings is that the fuel should be on site at the race that will be used by the racers for that event. No off site fuels, fuels of the day from "Just up the road" gas stations. They do nothing on making sure people are not cheeting. Hell a +50 to +75 reading on the digitron meter could have all sorts of go fast additives in it. Clubs conducting races need to arrange a local fuel company to be on site to sell their gas to racers. If the fuel company charges a ser charge for doing this it should be budgeted into the races expences. That needs to be the ONLY fuel used at the race so everyone is running on an even playing field.Run your own oil of choice as per the rules. This has been done for years at many OPC,Inboard,Special event races and Go Kart races with good results. The problem with an approach like this is to many people want to run their own blend because "It's my equipment and by gosh nobody is going to tell me what I run in it." My yamato only runs fast on brand X and my OMC likes Brand Y. The sport needs to stop being selfish about this matter and get back to basics.

[jsilvestri]

The fuel being run at races today in the "J" classes and Stock Outboard classes are all over the place as far as blends and additives. My feelings on the matter and I stress they are only MY fellings is that the fuel should be on site at the race that will be used by the racers for that event. No off site fuels, fuels of the day from "Just up the road" gas stations. They do nothing on making sure people are not cheeting. Hell a +50 to +75 reading on the digitron meter could have all sorts of go fast additives in it. Clubs conducting races need to arrange a local fuel company to be on site to sell their gas to racers. If the fuel company charges a ser charge for doing this it should be budgeted into the races expences. That needs to be the ONLY fuel used at the race so everyone is running on an even playing field.Run your own oil of choice as per the rules. This has been done for years at many OPC,Inboard,Special event races and Go Kart races with good results. The problem with an approach like this is to many people want to run their own blend because "It's my equipment and by gosh nobody is going to tell me what I run in it." My yamato only runs fast on brand X and my OMC likes Brand Y. The sport needs to stop being selfish about this matter and get back to basics.

Sounds like a great idea and seems simple to implement, but is it? At this time there is no simple solution to this problem other than following the rules. Unfortunately, there are always a few who simply can not do this and they are the ones who have created this mess!

[propnuts]

I don't see this working

What's to stop someone from pumping the gas out of the truck, then taking it to their trailer and adding the "go juice"? Do you make them mix it right there like it's a piss test? Then they have to keep it in the fuel dump? If you put all of these rules in place, then I could see it working, but you'd have to have a guy in the pits who's job it was to just be the fuel guy. Might work at Nationals I guess.

The fuel being run at races today in the "J" classes and Stock Outboard classes are all over the place as far as blends and additives. My feelings on the matter and I stress they are only MY fellings is that the fuel should be on site at the race that will be used by the racers for that event. No off site fuels, fuels of the day from "Just up the road" gas stations. They do nothing on making sure people are not cheeting. Hell a +50 to +75 reading on the digitron meter could have all sorts of go fast additives in it. Clubs conducting races need to arrange a local fuel company to be on site to sell their gas to racers. If the fuel company charges a ser charge for doing this it should be budgeted into the races expences. That needs to be the ONLY fuel used at the race so everyone is running on an even playing field.Run your own oil of choice as per the rules. This has been done for years at many OPC,Inboard,Special event races and Go Kart races with good results. The problem with an approach like this is to many people want to run their own blend because "It's my equipment and by gosh nobody is going to tell me what I run in it." My yamato only runs fast on brand X and my OMC likes Brand Y. The sport needs to stop being selfish about this matter and get back to basics.

[Shep]

The fuel truck on site works well at OPC and inboard races because they burn alot of fuel so the vendor does break even, I don't know if that would be true at a Stock / Mod race.

Mixing fuel and leaving it in a "fuel dump" would be Ok but then you have issues with "stuff" being put in the oil.

Bottom line is If some one wants to cheat fuel they will, If you can't find a good source near the site or worry about it find one at home.

It sucks but thats life.

Shep

[aojesus]

Russ:

Try Shell premium, 91 octane. During early spring last year we passed with flying colors at the sectionals, and that is supposed to be the time when Shell has the woe is me hug a tree blend that tosses the meters off the scale.

Have you got any Chevrons around you? We mix 50% 110 VP octane, 50% Chevron regular, and Red Line oil at 25-1, passes with flying colors....Simple blend....

We have tested positive with Shell, Chevron, BP/Amoco e.t.c. We have also passed with Shell, Chevron, BP/Amoco e.t.c. We passed at one race with gas that was 10% ethanol. We knew it was 10% but couldn't find any that wasn't so we raced knowing that when the fuel was tested we would get DQ'D.

The meter has proven to me that it is not reliable. Lakeland '08 our gas was legal. The following week at Jesup it was legal in one class but not the other. The following week we took the same gas from Lakeland and Jesup and passed at Ocoee.

Last year at the Worlds we tested + 60 something with Chevron non-ethanol gas. The oil wasn't added yet. Had to dump the gas and try again.

The other issue is the rules state we are to run pump gas but can't run alcohol. Try finding pump gas in Florida without alcohol, and I have heard California is just as bad if not worse.

On a three hour trip to Lake Placid we found one station that advertized ethanol free gas. Guess what, it tested positive on the Digitron.

[Dave M]

A Fix ?

Ya right. While Tom has a great suggestion, it is not fool proof. It is not any different than the rule is currently. We have race gas readily available to anyone who wants to buy it. Just call up VP and have it shipped out. It is easy to ship. Order yourself a few 5 gallon cans. Sure, it is expensive, but it will be legal.

Now if I buy the same gas at the race site it is legal as well. I still take it back to my trailer and mix it up. There is still opportunity to add is some special spices to make it better. There is no difference from buying it at the races verses buying it before hand.

If you want to prevent additives that are harmful, it needs to be regulated. And right now, APBA is not into gasoline regulation. They have much bigger problems to worry about. Like, how to stay in business and grow the categories. Perhaps if we all backed off the politcal step stool and actually raced for some fun the sport could grow. I can not count on two hands the number of rules that have been passed recently that simply don't make a lot of sense. They seem to me, to be individually motivated, and that is not right. Get off the politics and grow the sport, stop killing it with all these stupid rules. There comes a point when even seasoned vetrans will say uncle and go away to sometheing less regulated by a ton of changing rules.

[JBM]

Nitrogen?

I just went by a Shell station and noticed a sign "Now Nitrogen enriched"
I guess it was released this week. How will this spike the meeter?

[sam]

I just went by a Shell station and noticed a sign "Now Nitrogen enriched"
I guess it was released this week. How will this spike the meeter?

I brought home a sample of "Nitrogen Enriched Shell" and tested it today.
Test #1 was water solubility for presence of ethanol ... dye test did not dissolve in it at all, probably no ethanol.
Test #2 conductance, like the Digitron: GT-100 (the old less sensitive meter) 20 (AV gas and a lot of non-ethanol gas tests zero with the GT-100) ... with a Fluke 87 which gives a reading similar to the Digitron: +65

I noticed that BP is advertising the same thing.

[drbyrne55]

As for the VP fuel at summer nats ..... can the yamato guys chime in whether they prefer the VP93 or the VP 98?

Thanks
Dan

[Skoontz]

The nitrogen enrichment is because it costs too much to extract the nitrogen from the grain fuel, so they just use it as a marketing ploy..

[sam]

The nitrogen enrichment is because it costs too much to extract the nitrogen from the grain fuel, so they just use it as a marketing ploy..

I have no idea where you got that idea. There is no nitrogen in the ethanol produced for either fuel or drinking. The only thing in it after distillation is alcohol and water -and- as I posted above, the "nitrogen enriched" gas I tested today tested negative for ethanol.