SO Class Reduction Proposal

[ram95]

@#$%%# cough,choke.sssputter Ookay.

So then, the 15H is actually a 'mod A motor' . Instead of making it into another class in and (almost soon) of itself... why not just let it do its thing in A.

Then we can restore B to the class it used to be and have a whole bunch of engines in it so "everybody" has a place to race.

That way we can be ABCD again.

[Kev43V]

@#$%%# cough,choke.sssputter Ookay.

So then, the 15H is actually a 'mod A motor' . Instead of making it into another class in and (almost soon) of itself... why not just let it do its thing in A.

Then we can restore B to the class it used to be and have a whole bunch of engines in it so "everybody" has a place to race.

That way we can be ABCD again.

Since the B came before the A I would be more inclined to say that the A is a factory detuned B

[26V]

And Then?

@#$%%# cough,choke.sssputter Ookay.

So then, the 15H is actually a 'mod A motor' . Instead of making it into another class in and (almost soon) of itself... why not just let it do its thing in A.

Then we can restore B to the class it used to be and have a whole bunch of engines in it so "everybody" has a place to race.

That way we can be ABCD again.

Then what is the ABCD class structure going to do with the HR15CI? Are not the current SW15H ( B, or blue top) owners a subset of "everybody"? If New B is to include the HR15 in that whole bunch of engines, then letting the SW15H run makes is "whole bunch of engines" +1

[ram95]

aaaaaaarrrrghhg.... Lemme see here: A B C D E F.... Nope A came before B and "B" stands for 20 cubic inches (or darn close to it). That's the way B Hydro was meant to "B". Not this morphadite 15 madness. Put that 15 thing into A and let it fight it out with the Merc's and E-rudes.

Pass the BBBBBBBBBBeer willya.. yeah.. and make it a 20 ouncer too.

[26V]

aaaaaaarrrrghhg.... Lemme see here: A B C D E F.... Nope A came before B and "B" stands for 20 cubic inches (or darn close to it). That's the way B Hydro was meant to "B". Not this morphadite 15 madness. Put that 15 thing into A and let it fight it out with the Merc's and E-rudes.

Pass the BBBBBBBBBBeer willya.. yeah.. and make it a 20 ouncer too.

LOL life is a B..... and heres a BBBeerrrr, sorry only have 15 ouncer's but you can have 1+1/4 to make your 20!

[ram95]

Hey Gene.... the silence is deafening. Ggggulp Gggulp "B"rrrrrrrrrrrrrp We're "B"eeing ignored.

[Big Don]

Gene, serious question and I can’t spend anymore time trying to see if this was asked or you answered.

If someone was willing to pay for your 15CI Sidewinder to be changed over to a 12CI or 20CI sidewinder at their expense would you be in favor of that if the 15 class went away.

[Big Don]

Another serious question…and I’m sure someone will say pick up the phone and call and ask but that ain’t going to happen. Plus I think it’s valuable information to everyone involved. So here is my question…

How much of a financial hit would Sidewinder Corporation take if we did away with the 15 Sidewinder. I don’t know enough about them to know what all is interchangeable and what can be re-machined or re-sleeved or whatever…to make those parts work on one of the other engines.

So what would it cost them if the SORC and Stock Outboard were to do that. They are one of the few manufactures that are willing to build us engines so we need to look at that.

[26V]

Gene, serious question and I can’t spend anymore time trying to see if this was asked or you answered.

If someone was willing to pay for your 15CI Sidewinder to be changed over to a 12CI or 20CI sidewinder at their expense would you be in favor of that if the 15 class went away.

Don, who makes a 12CI? ??
And if the 15 class went away what choice would I have? So I ask again what happens to the 15CI hotrods? are they on the beach? I don't want to see anyones motor left on the beach. Thats why I'd be willing to figure out a way to try and run with the 20's.

Obviously If the 15 class went away, I would have to get another motor or have mine converted. If Racing Outboards has to pay, then I'll probably just buy another power head and hang the 15 on Stock Outboards wall of shame. With the investment they have already spent for us, I can not ask them to spend even more on a motor that the SORC has already approved. Its a NEW legal motor. Racing Outboards is hanging it all on the line for the Stock Outboard category. And dropping a new motor would not instill trust or optimism in the Stock Outboard category be it from racers or manufacturers.
And please, just for Clarity, define your use of "someone" that definition has a major affect on my decision and answer to your question.

Don I do understand that changes need to be made. If this current commission removes all of the 15CI motors or Just the SW15H, then they had better do it in a manner that All the current and new racers can understand and accept as necessary. Other wise it will just be another reversal next year or the year after.

Don, more than anything else I believe we need stability, and that comes from a long term plan that the majority of the current racers can accept. We as a group need to know where we are headed, why we are headed there, and accept that the plan should get us there. The Steering committee had the plan, is seems that the real issue was the “ planed obsolescence” of older motors. The other issue was “the plan” was never accepted by the racing membership. So what ever you do don't put any time line on older motors. Then just try and hold the line when racers want to use even more after market parts. Your only other choice is parity + for the new preferred motor. Good luck getting reelected with that one!

[Big Don]

I can't answer the question of what makes the Sidewinder a 12 vs. a 15 I was hoping you knew.

I’m not really sure where I’m going with this other than if we want an A B C D format then what do we do with the 15’s? Putting them with the Yamato 80’s is not the answer in my opinion.

I asked other questions earlier and was told taking the current Hotrod down to 12CC will pick them up about 1 MPH. Then I asked what does that do to the durability and got no answer. I thought the reason we went to 13 was to make them more durable? Maybe I’m mistaken.

Do I care if they put the 15’s with the 20’s, NO but you guys running in 8th every weekend is not the answer either and the same goes for every 15 driver.

I also know that we cannot show up in Detroit and expect that we will be able to resolve this unless some serious conversations happen. So how do we do that? I know Hydroracer is one venue but it has to be more than the 10 people that have been keeping this thread going.

I also know based on 40 plus years what happens at the meeting…someone makes a proposal and it gathers steam and the next thing we know it’s voted in by a 7 to 6 vote with 1 abstention and we now have a new rule.

[dholt]

Don,

The reliability issues we have at 13cc's are no different than when we ran at 12cc's. (broken crankcases)

12cc's will give more compression and should be more speed. Just have to be mindful of timing so not too much heat and burn piston. Of course, you have to be aware of same things at 13cc's.

Dana

[26V]

Don, then you are talking about the SW15S and the SW15H. I'm no expert so I can not give you a definitive answer to that question. the differences that I know about are: minimum CC's, intake and exhaust port timing, and the carb.

[csh12M]

Sidewinder

Don,

I started writing a proposal and had included language asking that S.O. Promotional fund monies be used to pay for the conversion of the three 15H Sidewinders that have been purchased. (Dudley, Shertz, and Wellings) These people can't be hurt for being early adopters.

I was also contacted by Racing Outboards the other night and they are adamant on keeping all three motors viable in the classes as they currently exist.

Personally, I think I have thrown in the towel. To me the "correct" path seems clear and obvious. However, so many see a very different picture. I have decided to step back and let others take over. MHRA is the last club attempting to survive on a "Stock" class schedule, but it does not seem viable any more.

I have young kids that need my time more than trying to solve a problem that so many don't think needs to be solved. I really appreciate all those that reached out to me personally during this thread for support. If it were a different time in my life I would fight the fight.

Hopefully others are right and the economy will pick up and we will see full fields again without having to change anything.

12M

[26V]

Quote" I’m not really sure where I’m going with this other than if we want an A B C D format then what do we do with the 15’s? Putting them with the Yamato 80’s is not the answer in my opinion." End Quote

Don,
If running them with the 80's is not the answer then what is?

[Blackhawkguy]

Dean

Dean call me or e-mail me your phone number
231-330-3318 cell 989-732-5455 Marina

Kerry