APBA Annual Meeting Agenda

[ddalton]

gran prix class

just a thought ...2 classes..lightweight...up to 25xs....heavyweight...up to 44xs....might be safer

also would like to see mod rules loosen up some.let more brands of motors run in 25 mod, c mod, d mod . this is done in feh only . they would have to start out as fishing motors. l run d mod (CBF) with omc 44.9 cu . in . twin runs about 80 mph,with lots out of the corners.would love to race it in U.S. but must race feh ,good luck.....also have 498cc yamaha triple ( 30hp) should be ok for c mod but rules say you can only use certain motors...
my point...cheaper motors ( BOUGHT FOR PARTS) more enteries that are actualy mods ,not stocks stepping up.

[Richard K.C. Mo.]

just a thought ...2 classes..lightweight...up to 25xs....heavyweight...up to 44xs....might be safer

also would like to see mod rules loosen up some.let more brands of motors run in 25 mod, c mod, d mod . this is done in feh only . they would have to start out as fishing motors. l run d mod (CBF) with omc 44.9 cu . in . twin runs about 80 mph,with lots out of the corners.would love to race it in U.S. but must race feh ,good luck.....also have 498cc yamaha triple ( 30hp) should be ok for c mod but rules say you can only use certain motors...
my point...cheaper motors ( BOUGHT FOR PARTS) more enteries that are actualy mods ,not stocks stepping up.

Are those omc twins in d mod run in stock form or are mods allowed?
Richard F.

[wagner-racing16-s]

bring back the classic d. I can bet any money more would show up to race that then there would be to race dsh now with the 44xs.

[ddalton]

great white north

yuk snow has arrived...
they can be modified....must use stock carbs. we use 45sst specs. for motor.
D-Classic is run up here, good turn outs....7-8 boats every race.l am building one myself &so are 2-3 more geezers....DD

[bh/]

Dch

bring back the classic d. I can bet any money more would show up to race that then there would be to race dsh now with the 44xs.

If I read current APBA rukes correctly , DCH is allowed [promoted] as a stock class. The race Director may run a 'Cassic' class, or, as of last year,
a 'M58H/M500H' is now allowed in DSH. One can run their 40' M55H with a 44" four port , or two port block, [up to '66] & KA carbs, against the 44xs, or as in CBF, as a D-Classic. A M58H/M500H, is not going to win the Nats, but at club races should be competitve. Last fall at a Reg 2 race in Crystal Lake NY, four Canadian DCHs ran in DSH against 4-5 44xs. One DCH ran 2nd, and the rest were in the pack. Eight Ds on a medium lenght course, aere much more fun to watch, than two heats each of four boats, and got the race over earlier. So build your 44, and enter it in DSH; -you will be surprised at how many follow you

[CSR4C]

D Stock Super Thunderboldt

The Mercury 44 cu. in. Super Thunderbolt engine was on probation in 2005 and to be a legal D Stock engine in 2006. It is basically the older Super Thunderbolt blocks with the center sparkplugs on the 55H or Bass lower unit. The commission wanted the 44XS tower to be used, but it was not possible because the tuner was part of the package. I did learn a lot about the Mercury 44 engines (all three versions) in the process of working with Mark Wheeler on the rules.
I know of several motors being built, mainly for marathon use.
Any one wanting a pdf file of the Super Thunderbolt rules can email me at csr4c@jps.net.
Darrell

[Mark 72@E]

Grand Prix

George,

Let me ask you a practical question. You get to a local race and set up both your AXSH and your BSH. You learn later that there's enough boats to run AXSH but not enough to run BSH. But you could run your BSH in Grand Prix, knowing that you would be running against a couple of 20SSH, CSH, and CSR rigs in the mix. My question is would you run your BSH in Grand Prix if that was the only race available for your BSH?

bring back the classic d. I can bet any money more would show up to race that then there would be to race dsh now with the 44xs.

I'm thinking your suggestion has nothing to do with my idea for a Grand Prix. Even so, you help me make my point. If it was legal once in Stock Outboard, it's legal in Grand Prix. As I mentioned above we have no DSH or DSR in Region 4. But suppose a "classic" D shows up and wins Grand Prix. And later a second "classic" D shows up and still later a third. Eventually we might have enough registrations to run DSH or DSR as its own class. And the D class rebirth started because a single D showed up to run in Grand Prix and was >>guaranteed<< to race.

just a thought ...2 classes..lightweight...up to 25xs....heavyweight...up to 44xs....might be safer

I know you're right about safety based on posts here on hydroracer.net concerning 25SSR and the differences between running the Merc in a smaller boat and running the Yamato in a bigger boat in the same field. Then I look at pictures of this year's Top O' Michigan and I wonder if I could have even finished the race in my CSR >>at any speed<< based on water conditions.

I guess my point is this. If running a marathon with all classes combined is considered normal and ok, then why wouldn't running a short course race with combined classes be normal and ok? In both marathon and short course races you're racing against >>the course<< (including water conditions) as well as other boats.

On a practical level, I think Grand Prix class could work. Grand Prix could work because it complements the need to reduce the number of classes that run with just a few boats at a local race. Grand Prix gives every stock outboard rig that loses its status as a regular class a permanent home in the stock outboard category. But I also recognize that it's a radical idea. To get approval of one Grand Prix class is tough enough. I think the odds are against getting approval of two Grand Prix classes, even in the name of safety. Think of Grand Prix like Top O': some folks may choose to run, others may choose not to run. Each driver makes his or her own choice and neither choice is wrong.

[Richard K.C. Mo.]

Cbf

Maybe the CBF could be included in Alex at Nats., ( International Nationals) ?

[bh/]

Cbf

Maybe the CBF could be included in Alex at Nats., ( International Nationals) ?

Richard; -nice thought, but they beat u to it, by about 40 yrs, at least. There is a long standing reciprocal agreement between APBA and the CBF, recognising racing members of either association. Many races in NY/PA and ON [Reg 2] are dual sanctioned, allowing entrants to score points in both groups. The 'Nats', in both countrys, require one to be a member to win, which only makes sense.
There may be ten or more Cdn. entrys at Pineville,
first time in LA for most of them, but some speak French, so should feel right at home. There were a similar number down last year for the Nats in Ocoee, FL, mostly DSH, Dmod, and a few ASH/AXSH. Those that do come, will not be 'dogs', I can assure you.

[Richard K.C. Mo.]

Oh Whel?

Hey dude , think i know, been late a lot in that respect.

Thought was been a lotta' rules bent sence my 1st time watchin' OB racin' in the Soo in '51 just Nor't of Sugar Isle.

Neal Hydro, johnson Pr with a tiller, got my 'tennsion. Never knew they had Steerin' wheels fer those thangs.

Richard F.

[bh/]

PRs

Hey dude , think i know, been late a lot in that respect.

Thought was been a lotta' rules bent sence my 1st time watchin' OB racin' in the Soo in '51 just Nor't of Sugar Isle.

Neal Hydro, johnson Pr with a tiller, got my 'tennsion. Never knew they had Steerin' wheels fer those thangs.

Richard F.

Richard; -get down to Pineville in March, bone up on your Robert Service,
and we will reminice of cool nites on "the marge of Lake LaBarge".

[STEVE FRENCH]

Next week is it.................

[csh2z]

Don't expect any major changes. Most of the issues being raised hear could not realistically be dealt with during one meeting. Until we get an honest evaluation of where this sport is and where we are going with it we cannot make any big decisions. We've been talking the same talk for thirty years, until we define ourselves and create a vision for the future it would be irresponsible to make many changes. Every time we change our rules it has a positive effect on some and a negative effect on others. We are too selfish to improve. We don't want to hurt anybodies feelings. We don't even have the nads to disqualify cheaters, instead we let it go and change the rules so the cheaters don't quit. Do we really need cheaters in our sport? Is satisfying current racers more important than building this sport for future racers? We can't accomodate everyone. If we really want to make this sport grow, we have to sacrifice some of our personal needs for the benefit of the future. Stock Outboard has the most to gain and the most to lose. There is a reason it is the largest outboard catagory. Honestly it is not in our best interest to go in the direction of some of the other catagories. Enough for now. Ed, could you please give me about 15 minutes or so early in the meeting to make a proposal to the commission, and some time for discussion?
Thanks, John Runne 2-Z

[hagerl8m]

Just some thoughts

1. I would like to see the SORC take some steps to selling the sport. I know that there has been money spent making videos and websites, but is that really what gets people interested in racing? Maybe spending money on TV time, advertising, or even letting people try out boats at races, with out throwing them into someone’s rig. I remember seeing Mouse Boats at Disney, and also at the racecourse, no wonder it didn't take so long for APBA to unload them. I know that’s a bad example. But it’s in the same thing we should be doing. Everyone wants to build the sport but nothing really happens.
2. Must have two heats to crown a national champion, lets repeat, must run two heats to crown a national champion. I feel to keep things fair; you need to run two heats.
3. Take back the Ax classes, I know that most members of the Commission were there when the class was created, and we gave it to the J committee to fix what was frozen, which didn't happen. Lets help build our younger and new drivers.
4. Make it easier to get a new race site going. It’s expensive to run a race, now try putting on a race that no one has ever been to. Yeah I know that sometimes races sites just suck, but it might help if the SORC could help out, maybe by promoting it races, or even helping pay the insurance. Just a thought.
5. Try to get the factory support of yesteryear. Maybe if we worked with motor builders we might still have them producing race motors for us, instead of us converting motors, if that happens maybe it won't cost as much for new members.
6. Create series. This tends to work in OPC, why not steal ideas from other categories. Maybe our best resource isn't being used. Ourselves, the APBA organization.
7. Boat numbers. I've talked to a number of scores, and here is their advice. Numbers must be readable; you will be given till the next racing day to fix them. If they are not fixed your not scored. Most scores cannot read the numbers of boats that actually meet the rule. Also with letter designations, those are from a day when there were 5 eliminations in one class at the nationals, and for spectators, which we don't tend to have. Just simply put make them readable. That’s all the rule needs to say.
Let’s no keep making the same mistakes, lets learn from our history and start making steps to keep racing alive.

Thanks for listening.
Christopher
Green Boat Yellow 8

[hydroracer25]

why can't you give up the # rule

"7. Boat numbers. I've talked to a number of scores, and here is their advice. Numbers must be readable; you will be given till the next racing day to fix them. If they are not fixed your not scored. Most scores cannot read the numbers of boats that actually meet the rule. Also with letter designations, those are from a day when there were 5 eliminations in one class at the nationals, and for spectators, which we don't tend to have. Just simply put make them readable. That’s all the rule needs to say."

Chris,

Q: What is opposite of black?
A: White!

Q: What is opposite of white?
A: Black!

Just like the rules should be.... Black and white (or rather) Black on white or white on black. These 2 colors contrast each other, ask any 3rd grade art teacher. If you leave it up the discretion of the 'racer' you might end up with purple on orange or even yellow on green. It just leaves too much room for interpretation. We don't need that.

As for the letter, it gives some sense of the location and participation, which is tradition. Besides if there were 2 # "8's" then who gets the right to the #. Maybe the person with the most years in APBA. You might not have the most years and may have to give up your #. You willing to do that? What if we just re-assign #'s to everyone in the country? Then everyone can re-do there #'s this winter! Maybe Kaos Kutz could give APBA a group discount.

Sorry for all the sarcasm, but this is dead horse, quit beating it! It's black and white!

Respectfully,
Mark