20SSH Sidewinder Removal Proposal: Vote NO

[Racerkyle20]

I will vote to remove the sidewinder from the class. Pat if you want to race a sidewinder choose a sidewinder class. Or get a lighter driver. Your intent here is to benefit your self NOT racing. Very selfish, expresses no vision or commen sense.
Your politics, ego. And BS. Are a huge reason I am retiring from outboard racing.
I could say so much more about you, but then everyone in racing. All ready knows!

Dave do you even know what your talking about? The guys that put the petition in are saving their own equipment (for the shorter end of the argument)! How's that for selfish?

I'm tired of your bashing of Pat on the internet. If you have a problem with him, be a man and walk up to his door step in Tacoma. Pat has done more for boat racing than you could even think of in a lifetime.

I normally wouldn't bring myself to your level, but when you personally attack my family in public you're cashing a check you're A$$ can't cover. Pat's man enough not to respond to your TROLLING so I will. GO HOME. NO ONE CARES. THANKS FOR PLAYING. I can speak for most of SOA when I say we won't miss you at the races this summer. Hope you can sell that rig, but don't count on $9000 like you think it's worth....

Oh and you're welcome for helping you get into the sport. That motor seems familiar....

[Matt Dagostino]

Hum

Dave do you even know what your talking about? The guys that put the petition in are saving their own equipment (for the shorter end of the argument)! How's that for selfish?
....

Of course Kyle i assume that is just your opinion, or do you as a current elected SORC Member speak for the entire SORC?

[Racerkyle20]

Of course Kyle i assume that is just your opinion, or do you as a current elected SORC Member speak for the entire SORC?

Matt it's just a generalization. Don and Mike own 80s and 102s. You put two and two together. I've heard their motivation, but let's be honest. They think the SW will kick their motors butt eventually (even stated so). So would that not be protectionist?

Did I say I spoke for the SORC? No I think the 2010 SORC did when they voted the motor in the class.

[Big Don]

Kyle, come on, really??? We are going to start attacking each other??? I thought you were better than that.

You talk about personal attacks against Pat, but you attack Mike and I? So now you are a mind reader and know what Mike and I are thinking? Yea I'm protecting my Yamato 80's. That's why Donny & I have bought 2 - 302 engines, just bought the second one last week. Yea we have hung on longer than most to switch but we had no reason too, we were still competitive. But we can see the 302 is the wave of the future in this class and took a gamble that it's not going to be the Sidewinder. If we are wrong...I guess we only race C. Yea, I guess you are right we are protecting our 80's.

What a joke.

[Merc1]

The Tohatsu saved the D class, why would this be any different?

[Matt Dagostino]

Cool

The Tohatsu saved the D class, why would this be any different?

Nice to have you join in Merc 1.........my 2 cents is the 20ssh class doesn't need saving since it is the largest class in apba and has been growing especially with new members.

The class has been a Yamato only class since the 70's and has always had a current available engine (Yamato 80, Yamato 102 and now Yamato 302). Why muddy the waters with a second available engine and fuss with Parity issues etc etc

The D Class had a out of production Merc 44xs that needed a shot in the arm. At least the Tahatsu gives a driver the opportunity to buy a NEW AVAILABLE ENGINE and go race.

OK.......back to watching it rain in Bristol!!

[Mrs blueskyracer]

Big Don has the opposite point of view and for those who can't get on or don't want to register for the social site I will quote here. He wants folks to vote yes. There are always two sides to a "political" debate. Folks are just going to have to weigh the two points of view and make and informed decision. The majority will prevail and the minority will have to live with that.

Big Don posted as follows:

"Just a few facts.

I was the main proponent of this petition. Yes Mike was involved, but it was I who came up with the plan to put the petition in place.

I’ll explain again why.

As an elected SORC member, I was approached by several racing members of the 20 class asking what they could do as members of the class. Their point was having two available engines in the class was causing uncertainty with a large group of current 20 drivers that were racing the Yamato 80 engines. Their argument was we don’t know what engine to buy and the Sidewinder has had reliability issues. They felt that if they purchased a 302 that in a very short time the Sidewinder could be the engine of choice and since they race on a limited budget, this would potentially force them out of racing. We all know that we cannot afford to lose any members. We also in our area and some others have had a difficult time selling the 20 class to new drivers because of the uncertainty.

So my response to them was the follow:

We could sit back and see what the SORC does. Many felt, including myself that this was not a viable option based on the poor track record of our previously SORC actions or lack thereof with the A class.

Or we as members have the right under our bylaws to do what we did. I volunteered to be the point person for several reason most importantly because this is what I was elected to do, represent them the members.

Pat wants to point out that this proposal didn’t come from the SORC. He’s correct, it didn’t, it came from you the members, this is your organization. This is within your rights, if Pat has issue with that than I’m sorry. All I did was facilitate the process, you the members signed the petition and supported it. There is a reason that the 30% rule was easily obtained. There is a reason that every region, had drivers send it in. This was not driven out of one region. Heck Pat own state had I think 12% of the petitions.

Mike can speak for himself but I do know he’s out of the country and may not be able to respond. But I do know many names were thrown out at Mike & I over the past few months, I believe Mike was using the names we were called in jest. By calling ourselves what we were being called.

Pat says they are not afraid of the work. We all know they are not, just like we are not afraid of the work. I believe all our track records speak for themselves. (all meaning everyone of you) We all work hard to win.

Remember this is not about the Sidewinder potentially winning. It’s about stability to the class with a current available engines. Yes we have hit a little bump in the road with Rick Montoya not having engines at the present time. That is not what this is about as Pat wants to imply. Rick sat on 100 302 engines for several years, can we blame him for not getting his order in faster, no one saw the success of the 302SSH class being as good as it was last year.

What are we afraid of? I think we have made it clear, but I’ll say it again. We are afraid that it will destroy arguably the second biggest class in Stock Outboard that already has a current available engine.

So in closing I urge all of you 20SSH drivers to vote FOR the removal of the Sidewinder 20S engine from the 20SSH class, it already has one available engine we don’t need two causing uncertainty."

[csh2z]

Is there any way this thread can be removed? The ballot deadline is near, all of the necessary information has all been stated, both sides of the issue are well documented. The horse is dead.

[Mrs blueskyracer]

This thread CAN be deleted by the person who started it. I would suggest contacting them directly with your request.

[Matt Dagostino]

Ouch

This thread CAN be deleted by the person who started it. I would suggest contacting them directly with your request.

Johnny........good luck with that. Plus, what's the harm with getting the issue out in the open on Hydroracer where everybody can show their hand. Heck, 54 posts and almost 4000 views in a couple days. At least folks are interested. Oh, and wasn't it Pat G. that got all this 'banter' started after all with his Vote No thread??

[Racerkyle20]

Kyle, come on, really??? We are going to start attacking each other??? I thought you were better than that.

You talk about personal attacks against Pat, but you attack Mike and I? So now you are a mind reader and know what Mike and I are thinking? Yea I'm protecting my Yamato 80's. That's why Donny & I have bought 2 - 302 engines, just bought the second one last week. Yea we have hung on longer than most to switch but we had no reason too, we were still competitive. But we can see the 302 is the wave of the future in this class and took a gamble that it's not going to be the Sidewinder. If we are wrong...I guess we only race C. Yea, I guess you are right we are protecting our 80's.

What a joke.

Don, Who's attacking? i have no ill will towards Mike or you. I've stated that from the beginning. I was responding a personal attack towards Patrick from a driver in our region who apparently has a grudge against Pat. That reply was for the driver, not you guys.

That particular driver stated Pat was selfish for trying to save the motor he owns. BTW all Pat has done here is urged people to vote NO. His opinion on the subject, and look where we are now... I simply stated that's what you and Mike are doing with the Petition. Call what you want, but you are eliminating the competition by getting the petition made a ballot item. You own yamatos (80 or 302). Whether the intent is motor box protecting or not, you still are yamato owners trying to eliminate SW's from your class. It's simple fact.

[burl11]

OK.......back to watching it rain in Bristol!!

They're racing now and our local FOX broadcast channel has cut to their prime time junk shows...!

[Racerkyle20]

Johnny........good luck with that. Plus, what's the harm with getting the issue out in the open on Hydroracer where everybody can show their hand. Heck, 54 posts and almost 4000 views in a couple days. At least folks are interested. Oh, and wasn't it Pat G. that got all this 'banter' started after all with his Vote No thread??

Banter? HE STATED HIS OPINION ON THE SUBJECT. That is all. And urged drivers to vote his way.Nothing more nothing less. No personal attacks or anything....It's other folks who have attacked either Pat, Don, or Mike within this post, Pat has attacked no one within this thread.

[Mrs blueskyracer]

Kyle you tell me where that yes thread is on hydroracer and I can indeed do that!

[Matt Dagostino]

Good thing

Banter? HE STATED HIS OPINION ON THE SUBJECT. That is all. And urged drivers to vote his way.Nothing more nothing less. No personal attacks or anything....It's other folks who have attacked either Pat, Don, or Mike within this post, Pat has attacked no one within this thread.

Kyle
I mean BANTER in a good way. It is nice we cal all share opinions and thoughts here. aka banter.

All good. Where did Pat's thread go he started???