SO Class Reduction Proposal

[Big Don]

[QUOTE=Haüenstein;167742]I know the numbers will increase slightly in October, but it'll still be a nail-biter: no runabout classes currently qualify under a six-race minimum.

/QUOTE]

OK...I'll say it...so what is wrong with that?

[Andrew 4CE]

Most your Stock hydro classes either don't or are on the virge of not meeting that too... as the points are listed today anyway.

[QUOTE=Big Don;167749]

I know the numbers will increase slightly in October, but it'll still be a nail-biter: no runabout classes currently qualify under a six-race minimum.

/QUOTE]

OK...I'll say it...so what is wrong with that?

[Howie Nichols]

Mike

I tried not to eliminate any class including 25SSH, all I did was put a restrictor plate in it and combine it with CSH. I don't want to see anyone go away if at all possible.

[Howie Nichols]

Boat Counts

As of Today per APBA's High Point Results

Class / Total Boats / more than 8 races

ASR / 71 / 18
BSR / 24 / 8
CSR / 77 / 19
DSR / 3 / 0
25SSR / 58 / 4

ASH / 87 / 33
BSH / 27 / 4
CSH / 109 / 38
DSH / 48 / 8
25SSH / 26 / 5
20SSH / 83 / 24

Why don't most drivers have at least 8 races??? That is only 4 weekends per year.......

[dholt]

Even Worse...

Look at the number of drivers who compete in 3 RACES OR LESS.

It's 30-40% in EVERY class.

More than 1/3 of drivers don't even race at 2 full weekends a year.

Check this out.

2004
Class Total Participants 3 Races or Less
ASR 73 30 (41%)
BSR 36 17 (47%)
CSR 87 37 (42%)
DSR 13 10 (76%)
25SSR 56 31 (55%)
ASH 107 40 (37%)
BSH 30 16 (53%)
CSH 124 56 (45%)
DSH 33 8 (24%)
25SSH 42 24 (57%)
20SSH 111 46 (41%)
45SST 23 8 (34%)



2005
Class Total Participants 3 Races or Less
ASR 72 33 (45%)
BSR 27 11 (40%)
CSR 94 37 (39%)
DSR 16 12 (75%)
25SSR 72 42 (58%)
ASH 98 31 (31%)
BSH 31 16 (51%)
CSH 141 58 (41%)
DSH 42 21 (50%)
25SSH 36 13 (36%)
20SSH 124 57 (45%)
45SST 26 8 (30%)


2006
Class Total Participants 3 Races or Less
ASR 70 31 (44%)
BSR 30 10 (30%)
CSR 85 35 (41%)
DSR 17 16 (94%)
25SSR 52 32 (61%)
ASH 88 37 (42%)
BSH 39 24 (61%)
CSH 120 48 (40%)
DSH 44 15 (34%)
25SSH 42 19 (45%)
20SSH 98 41 (41%)
45SST 24 8 (33%)


2007
Class Total Participants 3 Races or Less
ASR 75 40 (53%)
BSR 30 13 (43%)
CSR 70 32 (45%)
DSR 9 9 (100%)
25SSR 47 31 (65%)
ASH 92 29 (31%)
BSH 32 20 (62%)
CSH 130 55 (42%)
DSH 50 19 (38%)
25SSH 39 14 (35%)
20SSH 98 45 (45%)
45SST 27 11 (40%)


2008
Class Total Participants 3 Races or Less
ASR 66 29 (43%)
BSR 29 15 (51%)
CSR 82 38 (46%)
DSR 2 2 (100%)
25SSR 47 30 (63%)
ASH 101 45 (44%)
BSH 32 17 (53%)
CSH 125 45 (36%)
DSH 47 16 (34%)
25SSH 42 23 (54%)
20SSH 98 37 (37%)
45SST 22 8 (36%)

[Andrew 4CE]

As of Today per APBA's High Point Results

Class / Total Boats / more than 8 races

ASR / 71 / 18
BSR / 24 / 8
CSR / 77 / 19
DSR / 3 / 0
25SSR / 58 / 4

ASH / 87 / 33
BSH / 27 / 4
CSH / 109 / 38
DSH / 48 / 8
25SSH / 26 / 5
20SSH / 83 / 24

Why don't most drivers have at least 8 races??? That is only 4 weekends per year.......

So that total is 161 drivers that are doing 4 weekends across the USA... I wonder how many of those are drivers in more than one class. Maybe there are about 140 total? Ouch. Things are WAY worse than I thought.

[csh12M]

Thats my point

It seems like this thread is now driving people to the same conclusions I reached.

We are basically splitting 11 classes across 200 "real" (racers who race at least 8 races) racers. This is why we need to contract some classes. As I stated earlier with what I proposed you would only effect about 12 racers who raced more than four weekends.

CSH12M

[reed28n]

Which is getting back to where we were headed

If you look one step further into those numbers you will find we are carrying our current National class platform for a number of participants that are local racers.

That is why we looked at reducing motors in classes. Not to drop racers. Not to get people to quit. But to insure that new racers would be purchasing new equipment.

Parity would have less influence in the outcome of our National Champions with fewer National class motor options.

Really look at the participants in Howies class structure. Who has a 402xs, who is really racing the Super Thunderbolt.... or a Yamato 80 on a runabout. Very very few people in local areas.

My view is, why have those motors as options for a National Class when you can race them locally and still win you tee-shirt or computer printed certificate.

[Big Don]

I was kidding with the runabout comment...

[Shep]

Maybe we are asking the wrong questions

Maybe we need to be asking why are over 40% of the racers racing less than 3 weekends?

Are a majority of those people just jumping in to fill the field?

Is money a real problem for them?

Are they frustrated and not having fun?

Are the serious racers driving them away?

What can we do to get each of those people to just one more race weekend?

While the class structure is important I think you would have a quicker and more dramatic turn around working on the 40% to race more often because they already own the stuff.

When was the last time a promoter / race / club officials called to get racers to show?

Maybe we should take advantage of the tools available and have more personal contact with these folks.

Just some thoughts.
Shep

[reed28n]

Or a real question

Maybe we need to be asking why are over 40% of the racers racing less than 3 weekends?

Are a majority of those people just jumping in to fill the field?

Is money a real problem for them?

Are they frustrated and not having fun?

Are the serious racers driving them away?

What can we do to get each of those people to just one more race weekend?

While the class structure is important I think you would have a quicker and more dramatic turn around working on the 40% to race more often because they already own the stuff.

When was the last time a promoter / race / club officials called to get racers to show?

Maybe we should take advantage of the tools available and have more personal contact with these folks.

Just some thoughts.
Shep

Or are we catering to these drivers and missing the chance to attract new racers that will race 8 times or more?

It doesn't matter how much you race you are an equal head count in a region boosting the number of commissioners from that region and you have an equal vote, because you paid your tax. Your membership.

These are tough questions and these are tough times. Will ABPA make the tough decisions required to get us on track before it is just plane tough luck for all of us?

[Shep]

Or are we catering to these drivers and missing the chance to attract new racers that will race 8 times or more?

It doesn't matter how much you race you are an equal head count in a region boosting the number of commissioners from that region and you have an equal vote, because you paid your tax. Your membership.

These are tough questions and these are tough times. Will ABPA make the tough decisions required to get us on track before it is just plane tough luck for all of us?

That's a good question too. Just a quick look at those percentages tells me that member retention is as important as recruiting new members. That holds true in any member driven organization not just APBA.

Only a small percentage of new recruits will develop into serious racers even with ready to buy good equipment. In most cases they spend a good portion of time in the back and eventually go away.

I believe that with properly managed phone calls, email telling them " hey we'd love to have you at our race" and a simple "hello glad you're here!" " Thanks for coming ,hope you had a good time!" from the race committee and commodore of the conducting club to new guys and the existing back markers will have an immediate and positive effect on the numbers. The other solution is more of a long term fix.

Shep

[csh12M]

Shep

Great opinions Shep, you are spot on. However, I believe that a "welcoming" feeling and attitude has been adopted by all the clubs I race with in the last ten years. In the 90's, you are correct, we cared little for the "new name" racer. I believe we woke up in 2000 and are trying to cater to retention. We need the long term vision and fix now, so that by 2020 we can be healthy again. These are decisions that should of been made in 2000 but weren't. Instead we removed the rules that contracted classes. The last "real"(I do not count C2H or C2R) class that I can remember being contracted is the 20C.I." Hot Rod.

CSH12M

[modhydro]

One reason to let obsolete engines stay

Here is another perspective to answer Reed's thoughts:

Really look at the participants in Howies class structure. Who has a 402xs, who is really racing the Super Thunderbolt.... or a Yamato 80 on a runabout. Very very few people in local areas.

My view is, why have those motors as options for a National Class when you can race them locally and still win you tee-shirt or computer printed certificate.


I always wanted to run the Top 'O Michigan marathon. I was able to find a Yamato 80 on Hydroracer very reasonable. It allowed me to run the race and gain experience. Now that I have done it a few times I want to start competing rather than simply riding along and have bought a 102. It was a great low cost introduction to this particular event.

What does it hurt to have "second tier" motors available for the person who wants to just have a toe in the water approach to racing? We have seen time and time again the arguements about it costs $XX to race. To me having a low cost way to even see if a new driver likes this hobby is a great stepping stone. To argue that everyone has the same potential to win with equal equipment simply cracks me up. When you look at the people who are the usual winners and national champions, keep this in mind. They have worked thier butts off on testing and preparation and know all the tricks on engine, boat, setup and driving. There is no way that a new person can or should expect to be competing on an equal level with them. If they are being sold on that premise, it is quite a fabrication and setting them up for dissapointment.

An alternate tact is: "Here is some older equipment to get you started and let you learn starts and racing boat handling. If you get hooked on this, you can move up to more competitive engines." A controlled growth path like this seems like a far more reasonable approach for some. If a guy has the money and initiative to buy the newest and latest of everything, great, if not how about options. All the talk is about growth of the sport. Why remove any avenue that may help with this growth even if it just one of the "Very very few people in local areas." I hate to break it to everyone, but at this stage even the very few or to make it even more plain, one new racer is huge to us. Why would we do anything to eliminate even one new driver?

Steve Roskowski

[reed28n]

Mhra

I just received my Propeller The driver school did a great job. It is hard work done. Not only pulling off the event but publishing the result with photos in the our magazine. Planning and follow through. Truly Awesome!

Exactly what we need.