650 XS Mercury Motor - For Sale

[Scott Whittington]

I have a 650 XS Mercury Motor for sale. $2,800.00 U.S. not including shipping. PM me if interested. Thanks.

[Team B&H]

The real fishing motor version with forward, neutral and reverse? The one that the MOD establishment says didn't exist when they were trying to ban Jerry Wienandt who was killing all the 3 cylinder OMCs in Formula E hydro with his modified 650 fishing motor. It was so good, he even let Chuck Petersen use it once at the Nationals to win.

[Howie Nichols]

Sam,
He may be on the road headed to Marietta. But he will be at Zanesville crewing for Becky, I will let him know you asked about the motor.

[Team B&H]

Howie,

No, I'm not really interested in the motor, other than to put in a dig to the MOD establishment guys who argued that there was/is no such thing as a Merc 650XS with the 3 carb front end and a production, shiftable towerhousing/gearcase and here one is, right on Hydroracer. Jerry Wienandt had an absolute killer 650 Merc Formula E rig at the time and the OMC guys and their cronnies tried to outlaw him because they couldn't beat him.

I saw a small V bottom pleasure boat with a 650XS on it and it was a great kid's lake boat- something like an old E Production rig.

[sam]

to put in a dig to the MOD establishment guys who argued that there was/is no such thing as a Merc 650XS with the 3 carb front end and a production, shiftable towerhousing/gearcase and here one is, right on Hydroracer.

Merc made at least 250 of these each year for at least 3 years, possibly 4 or 5

[Scott Whittington]

650 XS - Info

Howie - thanks for your note to Team B & H.

Not able to download pics on the website (dial-up makes it impossible)!!!

Info about the motor: It is an original 650 XS, Short Shaft 15", Shiftable gearcase, Gears 1 6 4

Thanks for your interest,

Scott

[Dave M]

Well

What was the min number of factory produced engines, available for sale to the general public back then to make an engine legal ? I think they have since lowered it if I am not mistaken.

Would this 650XS compete with todays OMC's in FEH ? Is it legal today ?

I think just about everyone in the old days was banned or beached at one time or another.

[sam]

250 was the minimum back then

the 650xs and 2 carb 650 gearshift blocks are still legal, but the 650x and 700x SSM blocks are not ... not that it makes any difference ... and 650xs blocks can be ported to x specs under current Byzantine and arcane rules.

[Team B&H]

Dave,

The reason Wienandt was successful back then was finesse and sophistication, not horsepower. The Merc didn't have the brute power that an OMC can now develop but the Merc is lighter and lower and made a good amount of power for back then. Most OMCs were using megaphones and wierd exhaust systems, not contemporary small and compact systems based on MOD 50 technology. Wienandt's engine had a short, fabricated driveshaft housing that looked pretty much like the factory V-6 race housings with a pulse-tuned pipe inside- kind of ahead of the curve on that. He also had a super handling boat and could take Nationals-sized turns at full speed. And he had extremely good support with propellers from Denis Wiatrowski, carb and engine help from the Merten establishment, probably a few visits to Jim Ruck for trick machining and plenty of testing at Kaukauna. Funny that all those people are in Oshkosh, isn't that where Mercury is?

Would it be competitive today? It would run Ok, but certainly no threat to Vicky Smith's stuff. I'd say they're 5-8 mph different and Vicky's boat works as well in the turns as Jerry's did. But there have been 20 years of development in between.

[Scott Whittington]

Pics of 650 XS

Attaching photos of 650 XS

[Dave M]

Thanks

Dave,

The reason Wienandt was successful back then was finesse and sophistication, not horsepower. The Merc didn't have the brute power that an OMC can now develop but the Merc is lighter and lower and made a good amount of power for back then. Most OMCs were using megaphones and wierd exhaust systems, not contemporary small and compact systems based on MOD 50 technology. Wienandt's engine had a short, fabricated driveshaft housing that looked pretty much like the factory V-6 race housings with a pulse-tuned pipe inside- kind of ahead of the curve on that. He also had a super handling boat and could take Nationals-sized turns at full speed. And he had extremely good support with propellers from Denis Wiatrowski, carb and engine help from the Merten establishment, probably a few visits to Jim Ruck for trick machining and plenty of testing at Kaukauna. Funny that all those people are in Oshkosh, isn't that where Mercury is?

Would it be competitive today? It would run Ok, but certainly no threat to Vicky Smith's stuff. I'd say they're 5-8 mph different and Vicky's boat works as well in the turns as Jerry's did. But there have been 20 years of development in between.

Thanks Sam. It is a nice small package. Would be very neat to see someone trick this out and race it in FEH today with the factory cowls. Pit Merc VS OMC or whatever they are called now. Dad used to run a 75 Stinger Cowling on his FEH many years ago with the stock exhaust system.. which we still use today. Seems to be pretty competive in most of the races I have been to this year.

[MN1]

250 was the minimum back then

the 650xs and 2 carb 650 gearshift blocks are still legal, but the 650x and 700x SSM blocks are not ... not that it makes any difference ... and 650xs blocks can be ported to x specs under current Byzantine and arcane rules.

How would the inspectors know if it was a 650x or a 650xs block? Aren't they both the same?
Mark N

[sam]

If I recall correctly, xs blocks are sand cast and x blocks are diecast

[Team B&H]

650XS blocks are ordinary production 650 die-cast blocks as are the later 650X and 700X blocks. The MOD guys were always paranoid about Wienandt having a special, sand-cast block. There were a very limited number of sand-cast, 50 cubic inch loop scavenged Mercury race motors made. Besides the obvious casting differences, the looper blocks were taller with wider bore spacings to accomodate the looping transfer passages. There aren't many MOD racers around who have ever seen one of those motors and they wouldn't have been legal because they were never made in a service configuration. The ones I've seen were set up for Bendix fuel injection, not carbs.

I am unsure about the exact changes to the 650XS to make it a 650X and a 700X, but I do know that you can take the 650XS and machine it to the 650X or 700X specs. And since they all start with the same basic block casting, how would an inspector know which you started with? I do know that the newer versions had reverse firing-order crankshafts and one-ring pistons with a very thin ring. They also had a lightweight racing cowl rather than the clunky production cover on the 650XS as previously pictured. Wienandt ran the racing cowls and electric start and with his driveshaft housing patterned after the V-6 race housings, it looked great. Sorry I don't have any pics of it.

[sam]

Sam you are bringing up another completely different motor. It is so different no one would mistake it for a 650/700. I think it also has a different bore and stroke ... maybe 52 ci. Fred spilled the beans on it over on BRF over the winter. It was tested in Europe. These are so coveted by collectors, no one would have a chance at putting one on a race boat any way.

You have repeated what I said in post #8 ... there is no restriction on porting a Merc triple fishing block to x specs, the prohibition on x blocks is a technicality. I have seen sand cast 49 ci deflectors, but I have never seen one of the loopers in person