Kevlar suit certs...

[Andrew 4CE]

Surprised I don't see anyone gripping over this... people talk about changing an engine by 1/4" or weight by 10-20 pounds and it's a big world ending fiasco...

I've never seen kevlar sleeves or pants with a date on them? My stuff is prior to this I guess. Yeah-yeah... I know "my god your risking your life racing in 10 year old kevlars!!" I know how strength in materials work... my choice, until now, haha. Have these items been getting dates put on them for years and no biggie to anyone?

Does this new rule take effect for 2009 or 2010?

I thought these kinds of rules were in the book in the past and then removed for fear of APBA getting sued? "Your rules said this stuff would make me safe and it's certified to say so!"

[26V]

certification data lable

this rule will go into affect Nov 1 2009. It is a MINIMUM standard. It does not say your safe just that to run you have to have safty gear that meets a minimum standard. the new jacket and cut pants I purchased dec of 2007 has to be shiped back so that SRP can check it and put the label in them.

[Kev43V]

IMHO
I think no one is complaining be cause it has nothing to do with the testing time and prop changes necessary to "work around" a new rule

[Andrew 4CE]

So why didn't they make a similar rule with helmets? 5 or 10 year rule maybe.

I can use a 20 year old DOT only helmet if it visually looks ok. Makes no sense.

[Kev43V]

maybe cause the helmet manufactures did not come to them and suggest it.

(Pat please do not take that as a poke it is not meant that way. I know I for one would never let my kid or my wife go out with cut gear in as bad of shape as mine) so that proves to me the validity of the rule.

[Andrew 4CE]

That's what I'm wondering... is this a keep lifeline and SRP in business project? If it was really about safety they would have included helmets.

4 years... most the guys in Canada will have been to 12 or so races in 4 years. It's going to hurt many up here.

And if something bought in 2007 has no date... why not make it start 4 years from when the manufacturer starts putting dates on items... enough people got burned last year with the lifejacket flak rule. But maybe Lifeline/SRP wouldn't be around then and that's why? Just asking... like are they hitting tought times?

It makes it real tough when we only have about 30 outboarders in CBF to keep things rolling and are bound to APBA "Safety" rules.

[Graham 18ce]

Love it, I'll go get a used junkie DOT and put a nice coat of paint on it for 10 bucks and i'm all good, but that arm will cost you $300 and the Legs $350 and to float will be another $600...

Better start shopping i guess.

[reed28n]

Work Project?

This proposal was not a work project for anyone. Maybe we can find someone in Canada to perform these inspections, to defray this cost or inconvience. The Helmets were not a proposal in front of the Commission. The helmet rules were being examined by Race Management.

These proposals come from members. You guys are members. The proposals were advertised and there was no debate prior to the meeting on this one.

We should propbably look for ways to help this new rule succeed and protect drivers rather than waste energy talking about what could have been.

[Fast Jack]

Cut suits

This was not approved by the Modified Commissioners. There are a couple of points that should be mentioned . #1 There is NO standard to test the Kevlar, the inspection proposed would be a visual inspection -- based on what the Inspector "thinks " looks good. #2 If the inspector thinks the Item is "bad " it will be removed from service .. And I have a Question I will direct to Patrick " If you certify my Kevlar is "GOOD" and return it to me for use and I get hurt / Killed at the next race dont you feel that the Inspector and his or her company is going to have to defend there inspection in a court ? " How can this be done if there is no standard test for the Quality of the product? I dont think this rule should have been passed. There was no test Data provided to the commision , Just a old set of Kevlars. If there is an obvious problem with any equipment it should be up to the Ref to notify the participant of the problem and correct it.

[Graham 18ce]

This was not approved by the Modified Commissioners. There are a couple of points that should be mentioned . #1 There is NO standard to test the Kevlar, the inspection proposed would be a visual inspection -- based on what the Inspector "thinks " looks good. #2 If the inspector thinks the Item is "bad " it will be removed from service .. And I have a Question I will direct to Patrick " If you certify my Kevlar is "GOOD" and return it to me for use and I get hurt / Killed at the next race dont you feel that the Inspector and his or her company is going to have to defend there inspection in a court ? " How can this be done if there is no standard test for the Quality of the product? I dont think this rule should have been passed. There was no test Data provided to the commision , Just a old set of Kevlars. If there is an obvious problem with any equipment it should be up to the Ref to notify the participant of the problem and correct it.

Very valid point.
I would think it is safe to say that there are alot of unsafe "cut-resistant" sleeves and pants in use, same goes for helmets, boats and drivers.
Refs, Inspectors, and racers are all guilty of not enforcing or bringing up safety concerns at all races.
I have yet to have my gear gear checked for "impact". I had my helmet looked at once 10 years ago.
Rules are not the problem, enforcement is, inspectors, refs, scorers, are volenteers, they work hard, but not everything can or will be checked regularly. Thankless work will only get you so far.
my 2cents

[99R]

Here we go somone wanting to go to court if they get hurt racing. Dont trip on the curb outside your door it might hurt.

99R

[Fast Jack]

-please read again

My question is "how will the Cut suit company explain the standard of inspection if the have none ? "

[sponsonhead]

My question is "how will the Cut suit company explain the standard of inspection if the have none ? "

Shawn, check your PM's.

[Fast Jack]

Kevlar life span

I called a maker of Kevlar soft body armor today . They said there is no need to replace there product unless it has been shot. This a multi layer product that is worn 40 hours a week in all types of weather ,and there is no recomended replacement time or any type of recertification necessary. I was told cleaning in mild soap and water is all that is necessary to prevent bacteria from growing. This is similar to the level II2 body armor I wore for many years. I replaced a vest after 10 years because it got to the point of not covrering my sides becavse of an enlarement of my gut. I called Dupont and they do not make kevlar material , they only make fiber that is sold for secondary manufactures to make into any thing from hoses to woven material. Due to the fact they have no control of the product after the fiber is sold they have no specific time limit on the lifespan of the product . I am waiting for a return call from a Dupont tech advisor on how to proceed to test the product after use as it compares to the origionally sold fiber. I think that before a decision was made on the certification of our safety gear there should be more fact finding on what we are testing, how to test it ,and what we are looking for in an end resuls of the test.

[sponsonhead]

Well, do it then!

I think that before a decision was made on the certification of our safety gear there should be more fact finding on what we are testing, how to test it ,and what we are looking for in an end resuls of the test.

As a Modified Commissioner, perhaps you should take the lead on this and develop a suitable test. You could consider getting funds for developing this from the APBA Historical Society.

Security Race Products will be happy to provide you with Kevlar and Tuff-n-Lite Materials for your testing purposes and offer any other advice.

Patrick Gleason
SECURITY RACE PRODUCTS