APBA members it is time to get answers!!

[jswain3]

Entries

Blue sky,

Out of curiousity, how many racers do you guys have in MT?
How many entries came to your race from out of state? Also how many total entries did you guys have? Was there a full field for "CSH ?"
Just want to get a feel for the NBRA program is all.

[14-H]

;207740***
To ask members to go all the way to Detroit is asinine in its content and thinking, so as to view the "books", but that is what I would expect from the poster based on some of the other comments he has made over the years.

Glad I didnt disappoint you. I suppose it didn't occur to you to ask an elected representative to do the same thing for you???

[14-H]

Simple folks.. APBA drops my racing membership to $80 bucks and reduces the insurance cost for our club to put on a race to $1000 bucks.

That's about what it runs in NBRA. ***
Alex Poliakoff PNG
Commissioner, Stocks
Region One

Alex: I seriously doubt that this buys a $5 Million per-occurrence policy of insurance that covers all officials and members. If NBRA's policy is anything like the one AOF had years back that I analyzed, it isn't worth what they are paying for it. The AOF policy provided $1Million aggregate (read: total for all claims for the whole year), and it only covered the officers and directors (ie: Pres, VP, Secy, Treas. & BOD members) but NOT not the race officials, sponsors and participants, for liability coverage. Under that kind of policy of insurance, any race promoter or referee would have no liability coverage.

There is an old saying, you get what you pay for. That's true in insurance coverage as well.

[14-H]

The point is not that I have any or all the anwers, due to the hidden agendas and lack of information nobody can tell what needs to be done at this point. I believe first before I or anyone can expect change we need to get facts. ***Have a great day, Howard

Howard: Let me get this straight: you want people to vote for you but you have no idea what you are going to do other than look at the books (which you have a right to do at anytime anyway).????

This sounds kinda like Nancy Pelosi saying "We have to pass [Obamacare] so we can figure out what's in it."

[flatsmoke]

Alex: I seriously doubt that this buys a $5 Million per-occurrence policy of insurance that covers all officials and members. If NBRA's policy is anything like the one AOF had years back that I analyzed, it isn't worth what they are paying for it. The AOF policy provided $1Million aggregate (read: total for all claims for the whole year), and it only covered the officers and directors (ie: Pres, VP, Secy, Treas. & BOD members) but NOT not the race officials, sponsors and participants, for liability coverage. Under that kind of policy of insurance, any race promoter or referee would have no liability coverage.

There is an old saying, you get what you pay for. That's true in insurance coverage as well.

There is another old saying. "Assume Nothing"

[mercguy]

Howard: Let me get this straight: you want people to vote for you but you have no idea what you are going to do other than look at the books (which you have a right to do at anytime anyway).????

This sounds kinda like Nancy Pelosi saying "We have to pass [Obamacare] so we can figure out what's in it."

maybe before you make any judgements about Howards desire to improving APBA you should attend a few Reg10 SOA races and see how committed he is too racing and keeping it going.....................usually the first one at the race, last one to leave, doing most of the setup, referee'ing, turn judge, etc......whatever it takes to allow us to keep racing!!!! I vote for Howard! The current state of APBA is not good...............although Reg10 is still going strong....

[dholt]

Howard has expressed more of a platform on here that the names listed on the APBA BOD ballot I just got in the mail.

No clue what they stand for. Just what their racing background is. Been that way since I was a kid.

Not a critical judgment. Just stating the facts. Why don't we scrap the life history and tell us what they'd like to see in the future.

D.

[Staron]

As you all know, I am not one to be on the internet. However, I want to clarify some things as I know them. NBRA has K and K insurance. Isn't that the old APBA insurer? You draw your own conclusions as to why APBA does not still use them and why NBRA does. There are a lot of conclusions. I don't have the answers.
As to AOF insurance. AOF has had the same insurance for our 44 years. And yes, we are still in business and still racing. We just do it the easy way-off of Hydroracer and on the water.
Of cousrse we have had the policy analyzed by many lawyers over the years. It seems that even the lawyers who are critical on this platform have raced with the insurance. Those giving it the highest praises were also racers. Of coure, we never had a claim until the last few years. (Could be because we require strict safety rules at races, or the fact that the society is just getting sue happy), but whatever. The claims were paid immediately to the spectator. No fuss, no muss. All participants were covered by the AOF policy. Not saying that someone could not sue individuals no matter what organization or insurance was being used. There are other plans for that.
AOF has cheaper insurance for several reasons. Number one is that we have been and will always remain NON profit (44 years, so that is our reputation). Two: we have never changed insurance policiies in 44 years. Three: we supply the BASICS. It is $2 million, (not one) and a club has the option of paying for more at each race individually as needed. (Most race sites only require a million, and if there are no or few spectators, AND the spectators are managed (out of hot pits, sign waivers, etc) there is usually no need to buy more. Fourth: We do not carry medical insurance which is a HUGE expense. We do not want to be the racers medical insurer. We do have a Hospital Trust Fund that is added to with each membership and gains interest and is paid as secondary to a racers own medical. Seriously, if you carry insurance, why would you want to insure the guy who doesn"t. And, isn't APBA and NBRA insurance also sescondary medical? Just saying. Hey, and they do sell AFlac or some of those for real cheap to the racer.
I could go on and on. But, AOF is a third alternative. We are not saying leave APBA or NBRA. We are saying that we can offer an affordable alternative to clubs for the races that they either want to keep until better times, or build for the future. Keep a site alive, then when it is established, run it APBA or NBRA. And we welcome all classes, and if you want to make one up for a week end we can probably accomodate that also.
Our costs for a club are $60 per year and you get a free sanction. Our insurance and santion fees are right about $300 per week end. We cannot give an exact figure because the insurance company looks at each site (not literally, but you fill out a form) and decides what to charge. The average for 3 days fo racing is $300 santion and insurance with $2 mill in coverage. Add your own ambulance costs and club can probably make money.
AOF membership is $75 a year, but you can pay in 3 increments of $25 until you reach rull membership. (If you race only one AOF race you are only out $25 bucks).
Because we are truthfully non-profit, we cannot make a profit at the end of the year. We have given clubs PA systems, equipment trucks, etc. when we have excess money. That is the law per our corporation.
Our President is Dan Parker from Texas, formerly Maine. I am the Executive Director from Florida. We have Bobby Laws (OH) and Howard Pickeral (NY) on board as well as a lot of help from Steve French. I do believe these are respected names you may know. (well, maybe not me, but you get the picture.)
We have always been the best kept secret in boat racing. Sure you will not get a lot of clout racing with us, but I bet you get a lot of fun for a lot less. Sometimes, if you are willing to go outside the box, you get a lot for what you pay for. After all, a great week end of racing with good friends: priceless!
Carl B Staron

[Mrs blueskyracer]

Blue sky,

Out of curiousity, how many racers do you guys have in MT?
How many entries came to your race from out of state? Also how many total entries did you guys have? Was there a full field for "CSH ?"
Just want to get a feel for the NBRA program is all.

Please see the thread on the NBRA Montana Race for answers to your questions.

[14-H]

Howard has expressed more of a platform on here that the names listed on the APBA BOD ballot I just got in the mail.

No clue what they stand for. Just what their racing background is. Been that way since I was a kid.

Not a critical judgment. Just stating the facts. Why don't we scrap the life history and tell us what they'd like to see in the future.

D.

Seriously, Dana? He said he doesn't know what he'll do except look at the books. I guess if you are in favor of a guy who has no clue what he is going to do, that might be a platform.

[14-H]

There is another old saying. "Assume Nothing"

Fine. Let's see a copy of the NBRA policy. Post it here.

There's a new saying I like: "Bring it, don't sing it!" It's kind of a twist on the old one commonly put as: "Put up or shut up."

[14-H]

Seriously, Dana? He said he doesn't know what he'll do except look at the books. I guess if you are in favor of a guy who has no clue what he is going to do, that might be a platform.

Oh, I almost forgot, he did apparently support keeping the Propeller magazine in print for all of the retired boat racers who don't use the internet and havent a clue what a smart phone is, so that they can reminisce and see what boat racing is doing today. If that is who you want to cater to, instead of the youth who get their information from a cel phone, I suppose Howard is your man.

[14-H]

maybe before you make any judgements about Howards desire to improving APBA you should attend a few Reg10 SOA races and see how committed he is too racing and keeping it going.....................usually the first one at the race, last one to leave, doing most of the setup, referee'ing, turn judge, etc......whatever it takes to allow us to keep racing!!!! I vote for Howard! The current state of APBA is not good...............although Reg10 is still going strong....

I think I know Howard pretty well. I am not at all criticizing how much he puts forth to help put on races. I know that he does. That doesn't mean, however, he should be on the Board of Directors.

[bill van steenwyk]

Glad I didnt disappoint you. I suppose it didn't occur to you to ask an elected representative to do the same thing for you???

EDDIE:

YOU GOT TO BE KIDDING ME!!!

Why should I or anyone else ask and elected representative for anything regards APBA. You and your fellow obstructionists have just spent the last 1 1/2 years stonewalling about the CROWNE deal that the money that went to pay for that contract was MEMBERS money and they can't get zippity crap out of you, your brother, or anyone else that has asked lots of times these very questions over the time period stated and in many different forums.

How do you expect Howard Shaw or anyone else to know what the problems are that need to be focused on. No one can get diddly squat out of anyone in a position of authority. The BOD membership has been asked many times on this forum and others to open up about the CROWNE contract. Anybody answered yet? I haven't seen it, and I don't know anybody that has.

May I remind you that one of the purposes of this money was so APBA could communicate better with its members. Anyone seen anything on that on the APBA web site? They can't even find out how much the contract is for, much less anything else pertinent about it, and that is on the forum that the money is supposed to be spent for.

This is really the height of irony that money being spent to build and operate a web site that the primary reason for is communication, and the members can't get answers about that money or the reasons for the expenditures on that site or any other. That site, in case you have forgotten one of the main reasons for its construction was to KEEP MEMBERSHIP INFORMED.

Perhaps if you can't give better advice than what you just had for me, you would be better off giving advice for other problems, like DUI's?

[bill van steenwyk]

Oh, I almost forgot, he did apparently support keeping the Propeller magazine in print for all of the retired boat racers who don't use the internet and havent a clue what a smart phone is, so that they can reminisce and see what boat racing is doing today. If that is who you want to cater to, instead of the youth who get their information from a cel phone, I suppose Howard is your man.

Your scorn for all those who came before you and helped to build APBA to what it was when you started trying to make it your own private sandbox is really obvious.

Keep it up Eddie, there are more out there who want a good look.