Stock Outboard Questionaire

[Tim Weber]

We're almost to a point of exhibtion racing like the vintage inboard folks. If that's what the membership wants then fine. From the comments on the board it doesn't seem so.

All this banter about new motors and ready made equipment grows the sport is garbage. We need a plan to phase out old equipment. We need parity. Blah, Blah, Blah! We sound like the politicians in Washington.

What's the answer? It's the same answer as in Washington, Money ! In our case instead of the tax payer and the evil rich to fleece, we need an evil rich sponsor. The question is how do we get it and what entity is willing to spend it?

Forget the outboard and boat companies. They don't need or want us. It has to be a company that sees value in sponsoring us. It could be a hotel chain, restaurant, a number of things. I just saw on tv last night an add for super seal in a can and it had an SST60 in the commercial.

Crown Partners, whatever you do, where are you? I thought Crown was supposed to sell the brand and market us. Didn't we spend like 250K? Well, I'm waiting!

Tim

[14J]

The parity is perfect in "C" with the 102s and the 302s. Charlie

I will admit they are close. In fact the 302 has won several nationals. I do however question perfect. The national finals this year consisted of (3) 302's and (9) 102's. I wasn't there so maybe it was just the way it shook out.

[pav225]

Yamato

The Y102s and Y302s are a good match in C. Y80s and restricted Y302s are a good match in 20ssH.

What benefit do we gain by eliminating the Y80 or Y102 from these classes??

Mike

[stevegray]

Easy solution Guys " Go Pro and Run what you Brung"

[HRTV]

We're almost to a point of exhibtion racing like the vintage inboard folks. If that's what the membership wants then fine. From the comments on the board it doesn't seem so.

All this banter about new motors and ready made equipment grows the sport is garbage. We need a plan to phase out old equipment. We need parity. Blah, Blah, Blah! We sound like the politicians in Washington.

What's the answer? It's the same answer as in Washington, Money ! In our case instead of the tax payer and the evil rich to fleece, we need an evil rich sponsor. The question is how do we get it and what entity is willing to spend it?

Forget the outboard and boat companies. They don't need or want us. It has to be a company that sees value in sponsoring us. It could be a hotel chain, restaurant, a number of things. I just saw on tv last night an add for super seal in a can and it had an SST60 in the commercial.

Crown Partners, whatever you do, where are you? I thought Crown was supposed to sell the brand and market us. Didn't we spend like 250K? Well, I'm waiting!

Tim

You got it Tim, there is one thing and one thing only thats going to help and that it the almighty dollar. Tech talk, conventions etc.. wont do a **** thing. I have seen these very same post on here since I stated the site back in 2002 and its the same old thing Ad nauseam over and over again year after year.

It doesn't matter who it is, big name company or a small mom and pop willing to lay out some cash its all about the Benjamin's and finding someone willing to lay out cold hard cash. Call it the Comcast Cable Summer Hydro Series. It doesn't matter where or who the money comes from until you guys get some financial backing nothing will change. You can rewrite the rules, add classes, drop classes, add motors and get rid of motors its not going to help.

Demand that Crown Partners get the F--- off the internet and and start knocking on doors and making phone calls to get you guys some support. Also you dont need Crown Partners or Dan Wiener at races taking photos to post on Facebook for other racers to see. You guys need people out in the streets fighting to find you sponsors.

[Mike45]

QUOTE=Tim Weber;213691]We're almost to a point of exhibtion racing like the vintage inboard folks. If that's what the membership wants then fine. From the comments on the board it doesn't seem so.

All this banter about new motors and ready made equipment grows the sport is garbage. We need a plan to phase out old equipment. We need parity. Blah, Blah, Blah! We sound like the politicians in Washington.

What's the answer? It's the same answer as in Washington, Money ! In our case instead of the tax payer and the evil rich to fleece, we need an evil rich sponsor. The question is how do we get it and what entity is willing to spend it?

Forget the outboard and boat companies. They don't need or want us. It has to be a company that sees value in sponsoring us. It could be a hotel chain, restaurant, a number of things. I just saw on tv last night an add for super seal in a can and it had an SST60 in the commercial.

Crown Partners, whatever you do, where are you? I thought Crown was supposed to sell the brand and market us. Didn't we spend like 250K? Well, I'm waiting!

Tim[/QUOTE]

Well said Tim, Advertise, Advertise, Advertise That is the key to the sport it is'nt by having the current racers spend or suffer from our poor economy but get the economy interested in us or this sport is going to continue to suffer. We need to lessen the cost instead of creating it.

Even if we have to run numerous engines in classes we must do this for now. Think about it who wants to go see a race with 3-4 boats going around the course
Lets donate/spend a little money to the scorers who could then separate the CC's for scoring if needed. (of course it will be needed to be kept as competative as possible)

All this talk on the internet is great (for us) but we also need to give the public some reasons to look to the net other than a boat wreck on "Worlds Wildest Videos".

[Big Don]

Would someone from SORC please explain to me HOW restructing classes will DO ANYTHING to "Save our sport"...just a question that has never been answered..I already know all the yada yada's about decreasing numbers etc..So we restructure classes because?????

I’ll take a shot. And I know it will just bring 14 more question and criticism.
I am not talking about the plan to send stuff to the classic division. I’m talking about a plan like Dean proposed 2 years ago. What that will do is increase class size. It will shorten the race program. All engines have a home. It may just make us a little more appealing. No one can argue our program is too long and boring. I guess unless you like 4 boat races and running 42 heats in a day from sun-up to dusk.

Or we could continue to do nothing...

[Hutch06]

I think...

Maybe a look back over this proposal should be in order...

[bill boyes]

Gee I am a new driver?racer and want to run 25ssr and BSR.I want to be able to compete with the top runners. I would like to buy a Merc 25 and a Hot Rod.
Where can I buy a motor off the shelf? My point is what does Stock Outboard have available today without searching/begging except the 302. I do not want to run the D class nor the J Category.
This is just a test as you see I cannot buy either motor off the shelf. Can buy a Sidewinder. Then how come does a few want to send the Sidewinder 15 to purgatory in a new class which we do not need? Yes it has been submitted to the SORC. Stock outboard has a white knight who has invested a ton of Money( bet it is over $100,000) with little future return because he likes boat racing and are we going to turn our back to him and then at the same time whine that we need new motors.
I think that the BSR class is the best class in Stock Outboard racing. A very good ride, pretty stable, a chine turner, No floater boat/ Can carry the boat on top of your SUV/truck, the motor is light goes in back of Truck/SUV . Yet cannot buy a Hotrod. Just maybe can buy a Sidewinder if the SORC does not sent it to purgatory. Time to think SORC Commission. Do not vote your Motor box.

[Affholter66]

I’ll take a shot. And I know it will just bring 14 more question and criticism.
I am not talking about the plan to send stuff to the classic division. I’m talking about a plan like Dean proposed 2 years ago. What that will do is increase class size. It will shorten the race program. All engines have a home. It may just make us a little more appealing. No one can argue our program is too long and boring. I guess unless you like 4 boat races and running 42 heats in a day from sun-up to dusk.

Or we could continue to do nothing...

I kinda get what you're say Don...BUT..Entries will decrease..less entries=Less $$. I don't know the full financials of MHRA. This I do know..We run 3 in 2 for a number of classes and 2 days of Marathons (except at Constantine)..with that I'm told we barely break even. So get rid of your 2'fer classes (ie a boat/motor combo that can run in two classes) and what happens to those say 16-20 entries and the $35 that comes with each? You can't tell me that 16 entries in 25SSR over the weekend dosen't help. I can't afford two boats/two motors to run 2 classes. I'm sure I'm not alone. AND I sure as H..L ain't driving 400 miles to run 1 class. No Bang for the $$$

[Affholter66]

Don..Thanks for trying though..HeHeHe

[Hutch06]

To solve the bang for the buck issue...

I am speaking from a club who only runs Stock Outboard and Junior Classes. But, if we were to eventually go to a new program which ran similar to Dean's proposal from two years ago we would run J, AX, A, B, C, and D plus a marathon a day - this leaves us with time to run 3 heats per class or run 3 in 2 in all classes... would this solve the need for time on the water?

I'm curious what peoples thoughts are on this.

[Racerkyle20]

SOA model

Remeber class schedule on weeekends is up to the race chairman. They can pick and choose who they want at their races based on precieved entries. Mike Perman mentioned this earlier. SOA is a club that runs SO/MOD/PRO. With a growing number runnning 500ccMH, 350CCH, and 1100ccR (6 at yelm!).

SO is like Field of Dreams. If you build it (a racing class) we will race it. I love our club does this, but we are increasingly trying to fit a lot of classes in our day. Next season we will really have to take a look at condencing classes on our race days. Not because we don't have the boats, but because we don't have enough time in the day to run 3-4 boat heats. 42 heats a day, every day, all season is tough. Especially when unforseeable things happen.

A proposal like Deans would help my club out. Not a ton of repetative yamato/merc/omc classes. And we would still be able to run the MOD's and PRO's more.

If we could condence the stocks to a-b-c-d, our club would benifit greatly. And clubs like MHRA would not take a step back, but would have to figure out where those extra entries will come from, IE 3 days of racing in 2.

Ideal SOA class structure:
JH, JR
AXH, AXR
ASH, ASR
CSH, CSR
DSH
Novice C or 302cch (if that was still in plan)
OSY-400
350cch
350ccR (getting more interest out here, maybe not enough to put on a sanction yet)
1100ccr
PRO Antique classes (not all races)
500ccMH
750ccMH/ 850ccMH (750 and 850 were mostly combined last year anyway, when they came to a race)

This just dropped our classes from 42 heats a day to 30-34. And not all those PRO and MOD classes can even race at all of our race sites (noise).

Now are there still repeats? yes. But stock can't help the AX and A repeat. Does 10 heats less a day make it more manageable for SOA folk? Yes. Also notice we don't race the B class. In Dean's proposal the Y80 is in the B class, be out here our 20ssh are Y302's.

Last season we didn't make it through a lot of race days, not a terrible problem to have, but still left some racers in the cold with less heats. A more manageable Stock structure for APBA would help SOA and other region 10 outboard category racing.

[csh2z]

Reducing the amount of classes via combination is being discussed among many in the commission as a means of streamlining our program. Again, the consensus seems to be that attrition is the most popular means of eliminating some of our older motors. The primary reason to do this is, currently our product (show) is not attractive to any potential sponsor. Dozens of three and four boat races doesn't even keep us interested in watching no less spectators.
I'd rather see a combination of CSR & 25SSR, for example, run twice per day or a third heat per day than each class run once.
Streamlining our program will have other benefits as well. We could have test time, particularly for newer drivers. They need guidance by veterans that are only around on race day. We could run some classes twice to generate income through entry fees. But most importantly a product we can sell, to both new or perspective drivers and potential sponsors.

[14J]

Y80s and restricted Y302s are a good match in 20ssH.
Mike

Where does the Sidewinder 20ci fit into this picture? You mention 2 of the available 3 motors in 20ssh. I'm curious as to your thoughts on the 3rd motor.

As I sit here this winter ready to spend money on several rides, one of which is a carbon creation which would allow me to run 20ssh I find myself at a standstill. Do I put the money into a 302 or a Sidewinder? I'll be honest it's staying in my pocket because I don't feel there is a clear picture in 20ssh.