Stock Outboard Questionaire

[Howie Nichols]

For those of you that do not goto nor frequently visit the APBA social page, Chairman Brewster has put together a questionaire that he attempted to email out to all Stock Outboard members. If you have not seen it, here it is, please pass it along to anyone else who has not gotten it.

https://social.apba-racing.com/discu...-questionnaire

[Howie Nichols]

for those that can't open the link...

The future of Stock Outboard questionnaire

Hello all,
Our newly formed commission has already hit the ground running and with the help of Don Allen Jr. we have put together a survey to find out exactly what you, the Stock Outboard racer would like to see in our future.
I think everyone will agree that we can’t continue on the same path we are on with our sport. The SORC is taking a good hard look at setting the direction for years to come. Our stock membership is down again this year. For 2012, it fell to 370, down another 30 members from the previous year. Which was very surprising with the advent of the driver’s schools, I would have bet we would have at least stabilized the decline. At this rate it will be just a few years and we won’t have enough members to race. We have to do something and the time is now.
The plan below is a combination of past efforts of the former steering committee, led by John Runne and the past “Sutherland” plan by Dean Sutherland. Both of which had many excellent ideas.
We would like to understand where you the members want to end up. Not doing anything and letting us die a slow death is not an option so we need to do something.
Please take the time to read one of the proposals below that is being suggested. Please remember this is just one of many proposals that the SORC has seen over the past 6 years but it gives you the understanding of what needs to happen. (please remember, this is just an idea!)
After you have read this please click on the link at the bottom and take the survey. Your message will be 100% anonymous so please be honest. Your opinion will be used by the SORC before and during this upcoming national meeting in Ft. Worth, Texas. The deadline for this survey is December 9, 2012.

So here is a plan for the future:

The main focus of the new plan would be to direct our classes into having only one engine in each and that engine would be a currently manufactured one. All engines that we race currently, that are no longer produced would slowly be moved into a branch of the Stock Outboard category already started called Stock Classic.
Yes, this is a move in a different direction. Most plans have included the philosophy that we must have less classes and not more. Less classes only means less drivers when they quit. This plan leaves many classes for clubs to run and leaves the decision up to them on what will bring in the most entries for that specific club to be able to meet budget for that particular race.
Many do not feel parity is possible with the new Sidewinders or any other engine for that matter, they are all completely different engines. Parity is very difficult in our sport also due to ever changing conditions during testing. Sadly in past years when testing data has been presented, it is pushed aside as faulty.
This plan would also hopefully calm our current A class drivers that are very upset. Many feel that we need to learn from the past and not lose members by shutting them out as in the start of the OMC A engine era.

Our current situation looks like this:
o The 15s engine is now running great and too fast for A. With the new intake manifold on the Sidewinders, we will see our problems go away with tune-ability.
o Our B class needs to be a dominant class again.
o 20ssh and 25ssr have become the “C2H & C2R” of the past.
o 25ssh, Bsr, Bsh, Dsr, Dsh and 45sst are pretty much dead except for small geographical pockets in the organization.
- This plan would be a yearly phase process. Those classes that show excellent engine parity without needing to slow down the engine of choice may stay until phase three or possibly beyond. (for example the D class)
- Our Stock Outboard Classic division has not taken off and become a success in part due to no national awards available and no recognition for those that compete. The number one reason is, Stock Outboard "IS" the classic category! We need a place for our old engines to race. To do this we would need to make the Classic division be able to achieve National High Points, records and compete in championships.
The only exception would be that they would not be able to use their classic points towards the Menzies, Waldman or HOC awards. However, they may host their own closed course national championships at a location where they would prefer by a majority vote of those in the class since many of these classes are regional. (ie. BSR in Wisconsin, 25SSH in New England and DSR in Michigan)

Here is a plan in phases (and this can be tweaked in many ways until we get a proper fit each year)
PHASE ONE: 2013
Objective: Boost interest in the Classic division by changing the rules. Start directing the Sidewinder engines into the classes that they should be in.
ASR – ASH: Mercury 15 and OMC A
15SSR – 15SSH: Sidewinder 15s
BSR – BSH: Hot Rod 15 CID and Sidewinder 15h
20SSH: Same
25SSH: Same
25SSR: Same
CSR – CSH: Same
DSR – DSH: Same
302SSH: Same
45SST: Same


PHASE TWO: 2014
Objective: Begin moving towards the motor of choice in multiple engine classes.
ASR – ASH: Mercury 15 (last year in Stock) and OMC A
15SSR – 15SSH: Sidewinder 15s
BSR – BSH: Hot Rod 15 CID (last year in Stock) and Sidewinder 15h
20SSH: 80, 102 (last year in Stock), & 302 (last year in class), Sidewinder 20s
25SSH: Same, but last year for class in Stock
25SSR: 25xs, 102 & Hot Rod 20 CID (last year in Stock), Sidewinder 20s & 302 (last year in class)
CSR – CSH: 102 (last year in stock) & 302
DSR – DSH: 55H, 402XS & Super Thunderbolt go to Classics. Only 44XS Mercury (last year in Stock) and Tohatsu 50 left.
302SSH: Same
45SST – Same, but last year for class in Stock (becomes SST-45 only in OPC)


PHASE THREE: 2015
Object: Remove the rest of the un-produced engines out of the Stock classes and into the Stock Classic division
ASR – ASH: (OMC A goes to classics) Merc 15 stays solely in J category
15SSR – 15SSH: Sidewinder 15s (this then becomes the A class)
BSR – BSH: Sidewinder 15h
20SSH: Sidewinder 20s
25SSR (now called 20SSR): Sidewinder 20s
302SSH: Yamato 302
CSR – CSH: Yamato 302
DSR – DSH: Tohatsu 50

Stock Classic division classes:
Object: Form a parity committee to attempt engine compatibility
ACR – ACH: OMC A and KG4
15CR – 15CH: Hot Rod 15 CID
BCR – BCH: Hot Rod 20 CID and 20H
25CR – 25CH: Mercury 25ss and 25xs
CCR – CCH: 102 and 30H
DCR – DCH: Mercury 44xs, 55H, 402 and Super Thunderbolt
20CH – Yamato 80

PHASE FOUR: 2016
Object: Fine tune speed goals for each class
ASR – ASH: 55 to 60 mph
BSR – BSH: 60 to 66 mph
302SSH: 58 to 60 mph
20SSR – 20SSH: 61 to 65 mph
CSR – CSH: 62 to 68 mph
DSR – DSH: 72 to 83 mph



On behalf of the SORC,
Thank you for helping us plan our future,
Jeff Brewster, Stock Outboard Chairman

[Hutch06]

Before the onslaught of griping about this proposal comes out, how about it be a requirement that only APBA and Stock Outboard/Junior Class members comment...

[Fast Jack]

A class

I have time sheets from 3 races that show a Merc at AXH weight will run with the OMC A in ASH. Allow a lighter weight for the Merc keep the OMC at its present weight and add weight to the Sidewinder ( as necessary) to allow all 3 motors to be competative in A Class. The Sidewinder was built to run A -- Dont pull the rug out from under them now. I dont think we will see a flood of sidewinders in A . The racers that can afford to run at the TOP of the A class now with an OMC will continue with Sidewinders ,and still dominate the class.

[Wild Bill 96D]

6 boats in 25ssr in div 1. 5 are 302,s No 302,s = No class. That = ( -$360.00 ) every race weekend. NO CLUB CAN AFFORD THAT.

[BP125V]

Before the onslaught of griping about this proposal comes out, how about it be a requirement that only APBA and Stock Outboard/Junior Class members comment...

yes, please.

[G Stillwill]

I will be right up front with this plane and simple I bought two new A Sidewinders as per the SORC that was the future of the A Class not in 2015 but now. Now with this plan it they are put in a class by there selves which there isnt enough to make a class so now I sit with 9000.00 dollars invested in new available motors that will be on the beach with not enough boats to run with. If this does go through Im done with boat racing period and I usually field 2 B Hydros, 2 AMOD Hydros and one ASH and sometimes 2 A Hydros at every race. Ill just blow the dust off my trap guns and go back the the trap shooting circuit I can shoot every weekend, dont have to travel far and Im good enough at it to win some money.

[doc 35-0]

George!

George , Your to Old to quite!

[Jack Stotts]

Where did the "policy" eminate that says only one type of engine in each class? Seems it discourages the movement of new engines into the sport, innovation, and progress. Very poorly thought out position. With the attitudes I'm seeing, the decent of our sport's participation is explained. Jack

[reed28n]

lower the CSR weight

6 boats in 25ssr in div 1. 5 are 302,s No 302,s = No class. That = ( -$360.00 ) every race weekend. NO CLUB CAN AFFORD THAT.

Lower the CSR weight and lets bolster the CSR class. Race extra heats or extra races to triple that $360 you limited yourself to by splitting 25 and CSR....

[reed28n]

Not all or nothing

I will be right up front with this plane and simple I bought two new A Sidewinders as per the SORC that was the future of the A Class not in 2015 but now. Now with this plan it they are put in a class by there selves which there isnt enough to make a class so now I sit with 9000.00 dollars invested in new available motors that will be on the beach with not enough boats to run with. If this does go through Im done with boat racing period and I usually field 2 B Hydros, 2 AMOD Hydros and one ASH and sometimes 2 A Hydros at every race. Ill just blow the dust off my trap guns and go back the the trap shooting circuit I can shoot every weekend, dont have to travel far and Im good enough at it to win some money.

These are never all or nothing proposals. If we wouldn't have totally dismantled the action taken in 2008 we would be on our way to making some sense of all the motor/boat talk and just be racing. We will never know now, because we were short sited by emotion and scrapped everything. Let's pick out some things that have merit and move forward...

[propnuts]

1 motor per class is not the gospel...

I have said this before and I will say it again. One of the big attractions when I first got into this sport was the fact that the one used OMC I bought could be raced in the J class, and when the kid got older I could run it in the J class. In other words great 'bang for the buck'. I now own 2 Yamato 302s that can be run in 5 different classes (not to mention Novice C) in our club races. I know the Mod and PRO guys get sick of watching Yamatos run all day long, but the truth is those entries also make it financially possible to put on the race in the first place.

While I think 1 motor per class has certain advantages, the potential drawbacks could be huge. We talk about "barriers to entry", not being able to tell someone "yea, if you want to start cheap you can buy motor X, it won't win races for you, but it will get you started" would put up a big barrier to entry in many cases.

[Wild Bill 96D]

Lower the CSR weight and lets bolster the CSR class. Race extra heats or extra races to triple that $360 you limited yourself to by splitting 25 and CSR....

Lowering the weight will only eliminate the fat guys from the class that are racing it now. Witch is all of us old guys that find its too hard to loose weight. Don't see how that will attract new drivers. Not many new to the sport drivers under 180 lbs that want to jump into a CSR. (thank god)

[Jeff Brewster 59s]

Let's take a deep breath and re-read.....

For those that are upset about the plan above I apologize that I was not clear enough. There is no need to get upset, it is only a theory on how we could roll this out "if" we went to a class structure with one engine classes.

The plan below is a combination of past efforts of the former steering committee, led by John Runne and the past “Sutherland” plan by Dean Sutherland. Both of which had many excellent ideas.
We would like to understand where you the members want to end up. Not doing anything and letting us die a slow death is not an option so we need to do something.
Please take the time to read one of the proposals below that is being suggested. Please remember this is just one of many proposals that the SORC has seen over the past 6 years but it gives you the understanding of what needs to happen. (please remember, this is just an idea!)

Stock Outboard has leadership that is listening very intently on what the direction our category should go by the comments of the majority of the membership. A rant on the internet will not help your cause. Please send an email or call your local commissioner with your thoughts. If you do not have their contact info or if you would like to contact me directly, please send me an email at stockoutboard@apba.org and I promise an answer as fast as possible.

Remember, we have been floundering for years due to not having a plan for the future. We have got to have a direction to go or we are just spinning our wheels (props). It does not matter to me if we have twelve engine classes on the back of bathtubs as long as we have a direction for our future that gives us all hope and time for us all to adjust our own programs to make the best fit.

Thanks for reading,
Jeff

[raceright]

Before the onslaught of griping about this proposal comes out, how about it be a requirement that only APBA and Stock Outboard/Junior Class members comment...

No bad idea stockoutboard needs info from others in APBA the way it is being run now is why it's in trouble. Your decisions have a great impact on all of APBA.

Pat Wright