If I Were King I'd....

[jeff55v]

If I was King I would change the races to the famous Le Mans start, run five "classes" per day (J, 2-cyl. Hydro, 2-cyl. Runabout, 4-cyl. Hydro, 4-cyl. Runabout), and increase heat length to 15 laps. Boat design would gradually change and we would end up with boats that can run in all sorts of water, opening up more great race sites.

I would not put in a right-hand turn, though.

I like these ideas best! (I assume the LaMans start would be the usual modified LeMans start.)

[Raymond]

Sam,

I don't disagree...but...3-4 or even 1-2 more boats worth of revenue a day is just that; MORE. I am not saying it will be enough but it may be enough to help us to...hold on!

Our personal financial wealth is not created in one day. It takes time and the employment of many different tools such as thrifty spending, dedicated saving and a hard work ethic to get it to grow. For most of us it take 40+ years of hard work to get to the point where we can support ourselves without spending 40+ hours per week doing things we prefer not to be doing.

All I am saying is; here is an obvious tool to help, why no use it? Think of it this way; how many things can you use your height checker for? Exactly one, checking height but…it is not the only tool in your trailer that contributes to your racing efforts.

Sorry to be so passionate about this raffle thing but I subscribe to the rule that every penny counts. Thanks for listening.

[Jack Stotts]

I will never forget an experience at Grass Lake, MI in 1988. The format for the race was to run a closed course event and return to the beach and then sprint to a waiting second rig and run a short marathon heat. One of the participants who was back some from the leaders finished the closed course and came to the beach. In his haste in attempting to catch the leaders and sprinting to his second boat, he stumbled and dove towards one of the boats which had the engine running at about 6000 RPM and the prop well above the water, waiting for his holders to launch him . In the dive, his arms were out stretched and headed straight toward the spinning prop. Fortunately, he missed, but it was so close that I vowed to never see another true Lemans start in boat racing.

When we talk of Lemans starts, we usually don't mean running to the boats as they did in the real Lemans in running to their cars.Therefore we mostly do modified Lemans starts. Much safer! Jack

[raceright]

[QUOTE=mdaspit;170819]

Actually Stock membership has been in continual gradual decline since its peak around 1960. The same concerns were voiced in the mid 1960's by current racer's fathers and grandfathers as membership began to decline. Unless we are smarter than our ancestors, its something that will continue.
QUOTE]

Yup, and that is about the time that the National zeitgeist (sorry to over use that word, but I don't have one that describes it better than that) anyway, the 60's is the time when it started changing. The music, the art, the way people started feeling about things... anti war, anti guns, power to the people, the age of aquarius, college campus's, peace and love, a changing national consciousness.

Think about it for a minute... What a radical difference from the last change.

The change before that was at the end of World War 2. The Greatest Generation had just defeated a world wide threat to their freedom! And they were free to live their lives anyway they wanted to, because they believed they could do anything...After all they were Americans, and this was a place were a man could achieve anything he wanted to work for.

The change the country went through was awesome. The suburbs were developed, everyone began to own their own houses, cars became something available to everyman, and that opened up the country, the greatest explosion of new products ever, resulted from pent up demand, as the country's industries changed over and geared up for a peacetime economy...Supermarkets were developed to serve the exploding countryside neighborhoods, roads were built to get people back and forth to jobs that were plenty, and it was possible for a man to raise a family, and live the good life on one income... He was a King, and he had earned it.

Imagine how it must have felt to be a part of that...

But, who knows why things change the way they do, and years go by, and we become all to soon accustomed to things, and take them for granted and new generations develop new and different values and before you know it,
it becomes something very different, and the same old rules do not apply.

This is just my opinion of course, but boat racing is a victim of THAT, and not as much a victim of an overbearing sanctioning body, or too many rules, or obsoleting motors, or not promoting enough.

yea yea yea MY GENERATION SCREWED UP THE USA and boatracing
Well maybe the dogooders and tree huggers and Clinton Type Hippies, but the rest of the 1960's types are the crux of the tea Party and will set this county on a new path---enought history and polotics like I was told there is a site for it US MESSAGE BOARDS.
HEY YOU SAID YA WAS GONNA SHUT UP TEX LOLOLOLO

[Ron Hill]

The Rewards For Racing....

To those that ‘guff’ at the idea of 50/50 raffles or T-shirt sales I will give you this: It’s not the end all solution but it will put a few more boats worth or revenue into the club’s event cash purse.

Did I hear somebody say they used 50/50’s to fund tow money? Why not? How you qualify and disperse the funds is a clubs prerogative to manage but…why not? I think that is a fantastic application of a simple no brainier fund raiser. Who cares who is buying the tickets; revenue is revenue.

So what does this have to do with the solution to dwindling membership and growth? Nothing directly! But it may just buy some time…very valuable time. It may just be the recipe that helps sustain a club’s operations until we as a sport can solve the greater problems that plague us.

We need to think outside the box. Don’t give up people because when you do…it will be over.

I often wonder what our rewards for racing are? In SoCal we drive 500 miles one way, race from sun up til sundown, then get up and do it again on Sunday, then drive 500 miles home.....

50:50 deals are good, but I agree with Sam and will add, that this is really a "TAX" on the already over taxed boat racer. I'd rather paly poker with my friends, though, than go to Vegas. At least in a friendly game someone goes home with the money. In Vegas, everyone goes home broke! A 50:%0 is much the same, some boat racer wins.

[Original Looper 1]

www.whatreallyhappened.com

Quote from David Rockefeller

"We are grateful to the Washington Post, The New York Times, Time
Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended
our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost
forty years."

"It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world
if we had been subjected to the lights of publicity during those years.
But, the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a
world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite
and world bankers is surely preferable to the national
auto-determination practiced in past centuries."


Quote by: David Rockefeller
(1915- ) Internationalist billionaire, CFR kingpin, founder of the Trilateralist Commission, World Order Godfather
Date: June 1991 Baden, Germany
Source: Bilderberger Meeting, Baden, Germany

***************

Zeitgeist phenomenon? Clinton hippies? Liberal media? Neo-cons? Tea parties? LOL!!!

As always, follow the money and follow the media to find out what the true global agenda really is.

Regards,
Paul

[mdaspit]

Wow, it's amazing how these things can go...

All I'm trying to say is that boat racing is a victim of changing times.
And I don't think much can be done about it.
Except try to keep it alive, member by member, club by club, little by little.


Peace out....

[Ron Hill]

The World IS Change...

Wow, it's amazing how these things can go...

All I'm trying to say is that boat racing is a victim of changing times.
And I don't think much can be done about it.
Except try to keep it alive, member by member, club by club, little by little.


Peace out....

I live ten minutes from Disneyland, and vowed fifteen years ago to never go again. Why, too many people, too many lines, too expensive, too much BULL!.

Last month my wife attended a work shop about "EYES" and her reward was two tickets to California Adventure, including dinner and drinks.....How BAD could this be I thought??

Well, we followed the directions to park, and our ticket said 4:43. We were to meet at the "C" to get our tickets. After walking for fifteen minutes we called and said we'd be late, but were in the area....After asking more than one Disney employee, we found where we were going and sat down at our table at 5:30. 45 minutes of walking for free food and free drinks...

Drinks and dinner were fine, so were the POO POOS...

But the people...they paid $76 to get in, I actually never saw a ride, all we saw were people and construction fences. They were standing 15 deep to buy $6.00 pretzels. At 6'5" I've always said I never missed a parade, but I did this time, too many people.

NO WAY WILL I EVER GO AGAIN....Had it not been free I'd have had a 300 dollar evening. There were so many people walking and doing nothing that I couldn't see....It just blew me away how stupid people must really be... What the hell was there to do there? I have no idea. I saw a roller coaster, three blocks from where I was...all I saw was shops and people hurrying to spend their money. Looking at many of the people there, I had flashbacks of the movie Deliverance......and flashbacks of being in the Dairy Queen in Utah (The time I realized my kids were the only normal looking kids there).

It is nights like last night that make me think the world has passed me up.

ADD:

We had free parking!!!

[bill van steenwyk]

Rule #6 violation!!!!!

Ron;

I don't know whether you are aware or not (and if you are I hope you don't care) but you have violated "Chairman Eddies" rule #6 in your most recent post, based on his rules that are supposed to govern this thread.

I enjoyed your "rambling" myself, but you may want to be careful in the future and not upset him. He is after all a LAWYER.... and you know what they can do when crossed. He might even try to have you kicked out and banned for life from APBA. Oh wait, I forgot, you are not a member anymore. I hope he doesn't find that too frustrating.

[Ron Hill]

Thanks for The WARNING...

6) Ron Hill MUST offer constructive ideas within 24 hours of this thread opening or the whole thread will be erased. (and none of that rambling non-sense, Ron ).

I THINK I MADE THE 24 HOUR DEADLINE, AND MY ramblings all based on pure scientific bull ****!

I had a great lawyer, once. Donald P. Ermshar, drove Blown Alcohol Falts until his death at Marble Falls, Texas, a year and half ago. Not all lawyers are horse shoe, but most are!

[Ron Hill]

IF I Were Actually Hired As King.....

First thing I'd do, is ask the people of the realm what they see that is working.

I can see:

1. Nor Call 400 working. This is a C Hydro owned by Region 11, that runs the cavitation plate level with or close to level with the bottom and they run the Japanese stock prop. A ton of new racers got their start here. Jason Williams (45 Hall of Famer 2009), Troy Christy to know two.

2.The Blue Water Resort and Casino 300. Year years running, six events. Sailboat rules with handicaps. Anywhere from 40-80 new one day members per year.

3. Top of Michgian, needs to spread their word through the realm.

4. Vic Brinkman and the Michigan Hydroplane Nationals, though I didn't attend, I heard was really well planned out.

5. Wisconsin Stock has bought two new Yamato 302's to have a "LOANER" program or new driver program. Sounds good to me.

6. Region 12 COR Racing (Classic Outboard Racing), both 100 inch and 2.0 liter. Biggest races, 14 entries at the Blue Water Enduro, a new driver at San Diego, saw our boats on Friday, went home got his and raced with us.!

7. The J Propeller plan has worked, maybe it should be expanded to AXS

8. Minnesota has VP 65 with like 18 people in this class. They also have GT PRO and Mini GT
9. Texas has Tri Hulls
10. Having H1 Hydros under the APBA banner, means APBA members have the BIGGEST names in racing driving under the APBA Banner

11. Look at what AOF and NBRA in Washington, Arkansas and Oklahoma are doing and have done!

Once I got a handle ,on the positives, I would seek to improve upon these.

[Skoontz]

MDA you're almost right. It is not the changing times, in whole. For the most part has been the unwillingness of those who wont roll with the changing times for everything from dont want to spend the money, to they are dialed in with what they got and why change, this works....But it doesnt work in the sense that APBA is facing certain death. I equate this to when the doctor told me my dad had about 6 months and I refused to believe him...About a year later, dad was gone....

That said, changes to be made, first order of business is to get the boats off the interior piss puddles and onto water that lots of people walk by.

Thats going to bring rougher water and your hydros will need deeper sponsons, or for that matter may need to be mothballed, and so will your engines..
I personally like the mod VP design, and will have a 12 footer complete in about a month, but you could run a Vee, or semi Vee as well.

Get rid of one manufacturers engine per class and adopt a run what you brung, anything within a factory displacement class. Thats going to mean a book of specs for the inspectors, but so be it.
Add, no direct drive gearcases, you run factory stock forward nuetral reverse gear cases.

In the case of JR. or entry classes, that makes all the sense in the world, I've done extensive testing with stock gear cases on an OMC A and a Merc AXS engine. It makes no sense to install a $1200 gearcase to make it go fast and stuff a $10 hunk of tin between the carbeuretor and manifold to slow it down....

Any prop goes, except in beginer classes, there you run Aluminum props, and they will be weighed in case some genius decided to thin the blades.

If no one sees what you are trying to sell, as the families of boat racers decline, so will boat racing, and so has boat racing. We are not selling to racers, we are targeting the bigger picture, the fans. Fans become sponsors, by buying tickets, and some become racers just as what happened in San Diego this year.

I know the firestorm this type of out of the box thinking gets me with APBA members...Frankly I dont care anymore. I'm not posting this to win a popularity contest.

When my daughter and I entered the sport in 2007, it was an exciting, fun family thing to do. The first years failures of the J class and lack of mentors who would dedicate the time in our region started our thoughts of getting out.
This statement excludes those who came forward and gave advice and lended a hand to a guy (me) who knew little about race boats, but allot about boats and engines in general. The current entry level class is a class designed by racers for their kids....That is its biggest flaw. It fails miserably in the user friendly department, it fals in the easy access department, and it is not necessarily an inexpensive thing. When you can buy a jet ski for about the same money and use it every weekend, and you can only use your race boat once a month, that does mnot pencil out i n the fun department.

This is where the deeper hulls and stock gear cases come in. Those boats could actually be run on weekends if the owner chose to.

Then as we drove around the western states to races, we noticed less and less boats at every event. Why? For one, no one knows about races, nor who the hell wants to drive 20 miles around Kellys Barn to some piss puddle in the middle of a desert?...(I'm talking about fans here.)
Getting off the piss puddles will do volumes in the way of marketing without spending a dime on promotional materials..

As we have progressed through the years, my daughter and I decided to turn another way, we will still be boat racing, in a very limited capacity. Our rig could be for sale, for the right price and not a cent under....

We are entering NHRA Jr. Comp Dragster, where they allow 3 different engines, 20 different wheels and tires, 15 different chassis etc etc etc. And they dont have some chicken crap rule about how heavy the flywheel has to be dictated by part number......

It costs $25 for Saturday qualification, and you can get 6 passes before eliminations. You make it to Sunday, it's $75.00. And there are usually 1000 or more fans every weekend.

I give boat racing 10 years. It will stay strong in some regions, and in others it will wither and die. Sorry to sound so negative, I'm a realist, and my observations are seldom wrong. This time I hope I'm wrong.


You asked for what it will take to save it, and thats it.

ADD: Either add a sweep hand to the back side of the start clock so the fans can see what the hell is going on, or go to lemans starts where they run to the boats, start the motors, and fly out of the shore. I can hear everyone moaning about that one right now...In the eyes of the fans, "What the heck is that big orange clock there for"?

[Ron Hill]

To Add To Skoontz's Statements...

Isleton has had two years in two years. They paid $250 tow money per boat both years, they paid prize money. They are planning an "EVENT" for 2011.

This Isleton town water was deemed "TOO ROUGH" to race by kneeldown racers. With my assistance, they've run two profitable races, and they run only three classes, Sport C, 45 and Cracker Box...

It might be noted, too, that this race has between 8 and 13 Sport C's. Region 11 has many Sport C's.....and many don't like Sport C's because they don't have racing gearcases...they sound strange.....but the Sport C guys come to every race pay their fee, work the patrol boats, work on the stands...

Clubs need "36 type classes"...

[jeff55v]

That said, changes to be made, first order of business is to get the boats off the interior piss puddles and onto water that lots of people walk by.
Thats going to bring rougher water and your hydros will need deeper sponsons, or for that matter may need to be mothballed, and so will your engines.
... Add, no direct drive gearcases, you run factory stock forward nuetral reverse gear cases.
... This is where the deeper hulls and stock gear cases come in. Those boats could actually be run on weekends if the owner chose to.

You may be right about some of these ideas, But what you discribe sounds a lot like an SLT boat. Stock gearcases, can race in any water condition, can be used for family fun during off racing weekends.
They're struggling to get enough participation too.
I'm just saying.

[Skoontz]

Jeff:

What I would ask then is when they race, are they racing in front of large groups, such as Bayfair, or perhaps in rougher lakes as Lake Geneva Wisc.? Williams Bay for example would be a geat place to hold a race, launch by Chucks Pub, its a little dog leg off the lake. Places where lots of people are or go to are what the target needs to be. Those two things need to be worked hand in hand and if they are, things will change.