Day 1 at Raleigh

[Bill Huson]

Ah yes, the memories . . .

of those Northern VA traffic jams. I'll pass on your invite, Dan. The trauma (PTSS) is so bad I get the sweats even thinking about going North. I did visit No Va last November to settle on my house. Milady got the shakes around Richmond. The mixing bowl (Kamakazi Junction) was alomost done - looked like the concrete monster crapped flyover spaghetti

[Joe J]

Tim:

With all due respect, your comment was uncalled for. I think most of us have both won, and lost races this way over the years.

Unless you have spent time on a judges stand, attempting to call a 12 boat start, you do not know how hectic things can get.

Joe

Kristi, I got 1st until the unnessesary rerun of the final which changed the result to Wil Tetro 1st, myself 2nd, and Billy Allen 3rd. Great hard racing by all the drivers all weekend.

[raceright]

Tim:

With all due respect, your comment was uncalled for. I think most of us have both won, and lost races this way over the years.

Unless you have spent time on a judges stand, attempting to call a 12 boat start, you do not know how hectic things can get.

Joe

Hey Joe

The situation with 125 will be revisited at the national meeting. At La if you remember we had much discussion over this happening I believe we were in agreement that although the commission did not take any action to help this type of situation(like larger # on boats or less boats on the race course)
if the scorers could not see a boat or read a # they would be disqualified,this process would be done by scoring only the boats that scorers could identify. I for one as well as Bill Tetro believe that this heat should not of been rerun. So you see Bill and myself believe that Tim's comment is accurate even though Bill's son would have not won the race.

Pat

[Kristi Ellison]

Well I disagree....the boats could not be seen in the spray and sun...it had nothing to do with illegible boat numbers. The Commission has no business interferring in the judges stand decsion. They made the right decsion in order to be fair to all the racers. Guessing who is legal or not legal is not fair. When everyone cannot agree on what they saw due to uncontrollable interference the right thing to do is re-run. These people are volunteers and if we who don't work on the judges stand do not support them we will drive them out and then we will sit on the beach. Don't ruin what was otherwise a great weekend by putting this kind of crap on the internet. You can haggle over this stuff when you are making a million dollars a weekend!

[raceright]

Well I disagree....the boats could not be seen in the spray and sun...it had nothing to do with illegible boat numbers. The Commission has no business interferring in the judges stand decsion. They made the right decsion in order to be fair to all the racers. Guessing who is legal or not legal is not fair. When everyone cannot agree on what they saw due to uncontrollable interference the right thig to do is re-run. These people are volunteers and if we who don't work on the judges stand do not support them we will drive them out and then we will sit on the beach. Don't ruin what was otherwise a great weekend by putting this kind of crap on the internet. You can haggle over this stuff when you are making a million dollars a weekend!

Kristi
I do not agree with the call, not that the scorers did anything wrong and yes I have worked the judges stand in Fla in the 80's at Lake Worth with over 200 entries. I do understand how difficult this is and it would of been easier on the Scorers to not rerun the heat they believed they did the right thing.
and noone I repeat noone should approach the Judges stand but therse type
of situations cause much confusion and will be discussed at the Detroit meeting for sure. We have to support our scorers all the more reason to make sure the commission has provided proper guidance for situations like this. Enough said by me as Bill Oriely says I'll let you or some one else have the last word and yes it was a great weekend even thought I jumped in the last heat of 1100 where I had 2nd for sure what a way to end a season.
Still love me I hope

[David Weaver]

125cc Re-Start

I was serving as race director during this set. I was not on the judges stand at the time of the start. I did predict that a re-start would be forthcoming, because 10 boats were at or near the start line at the same time. When the outside boat crosses the line first, it is tough to see the boat numbers through its spray. Add that the sun had rolled over to west and added glare....

A lot of people were updset or disapoointed by the decision to re-run. These people are my firends, but I focused on what was fair to the group, not what was best for individuals. Plus, we did our best to work within the limitations set by the rule book. The USTS will work to improve our starting equipment for the forthcoming season and I hope that we can make the job of the judges stand a bit easier going forward.

[Kristi Ellison]

Pat

If you don't agree with the call then what would you have done? If you don't know who the 5th gun jumper was and therefore don't know who the legal boats are how would you call it??
Tetro was one of the jumpers and he did not give up the name of the guy on his inside who's boat color or number could not be seen in the spray or color washout on the video camara due the the sun. What would we need to discuss in Detroit to fix this.....in my opinion nothing. You have to score the heat fairly in order to be fair it helps to know who is legal...in this case re-run.
Now I have had my last word on this.....and of course I still love you

[scorer]

I was there

As one of the scorers on the stand, we had the first 4 gun jumpers, there was a 5th hidden in the spray.

Then there were 2 or 3 legal boats in a line up. We did not have all the numbers. There were 4 boats bunched up after that.

What would you have done that would have been more fair?.

Pat, scoring in the 80's is different than scoring now. I did then and am still doing it today.

Respect and support start here, as I have stated earlier, job is open if you want it. Bev

[Joe J]

Pat:

This was a race committee decision, and as such has no business being discussed at the national meeting.

In LA, we discussed boat numbers, the subject of calling a start never came up.

The only rule book I have at the moment is the 2005 book, so unless the rule numbers have changed, please read rule 4-8-b, I believe it covers what happened.

Joe

Hey Joe

The situation with 125 will be revisited at the national meeting. At La if you remember we had much discussion over this happening I believe we were in agreement that although the commission did not take any action to help this type of situation(like larger # on boats or less boats on the race course)
if the scorers could not see a boat or read a # they would be disqualified,this process would be done by scoring only the boats that scorers could identify. I for one as well as Bill Tetro believe that this heat should not of been rerun. So you see Bill and myself believe that Tim's comment is accurate even though Bill's son would have not won the race.

Pat

[YankeeRacing]

It seems to me, as a Referee, and a scorer of millions of races (seems like that anyway), that the rulebook already addresses the issue. You rerun if you need to. (Rule is much more complex, but means that).
I have a solution, anyone on HR or the race who has an issue with the judges stand will give up 2 races per year (at least) and work the judges stand AND find their own crew to do it. Give the "inadequate" as some are insinuating, present scorers, a chance to sit back and actually watch a race for a change.
Can anyone imagine what this thread would be like if the scorers just guessed at who was legal or who wasn't?
Geeesh. This just p's me off. And I still love everyone.
Connie Payn

[L. Allen]

A P P L A U S E .

[raceright]

raleigh

Have raced here three times and what a great place to race hope Kristi and Robbie can pull this off again as 600 miles from home this is my closest Title Series Race. The weather was great and we even got to test learned a few things but still managed to jump in last heat(realy got me mad at myself)
Pate Gevinski after a realy ruff year managed to get a second in 1100 top hydro was realy starting to think we might lose him but not now. We definatly put in some overtime on this one..Myself,Jimmy,Bob Rusnak,Pete Geskowitz(probably spelled wrong) tried everything to get this 700 right and something we did worked..Oh yea Mike Thirlby I will not forget what I promised you...
So Kristi when you can think about next year let us know
and thanks to all (especialy the ladies) for a realy super year

Oh yea Bev Give me a little piece will ya(ha ha ha Private joke hear)

Pat

[scorer]

Spelling

Pat,
Please, the spelling is peace, we've had this discussion. I was the one listening. See ya in Nov. Bev

[Tim Small]

Raleigh 125

Just to end this thread, what I meant by unessessary rerun of the final was that the top 5 drivers, Small, Tetro, Allen, Tennel, and Jones did not care about rerunning it, they were all satisfied with the outcome. All 5 were at the judges stand agreeing to not run another heat. No other drivers had a chance for a top three either way. Also, Joe I have worked the judges stand since the 70s, also national championships. Hope everyone has a great off season, hope to see some of you in November at the USTS meeting and awards banquet. P.S- Bev, put me down for chicken please