2009 J Rules & Proposals

[RShane]

November 6, 2008


J Class Members:

In our effort to govern this category, the J Committee will accept rule changes and proposals using the following guideline:

Please submit your rule proposal by January 7, 2009

If it pertains to an existing rule:

State the original rule.

State proposed rule.

State reason for change

If it is a new rule:

State proposed rule and proposed location within existing rules.

State reason for new rule

Send rules to: robin.shane@verizon.net


The Committee realizes the importance of this category. It is with this thought and knowing the time restraints at the National Convention that a deadline is being implemented. The deadline will allow the committee to review and get further information if necessary. It is the goal of the committee to leave the national meeting with no further business for the remainder of the race season.

[Kev43V]

here is a thought:
what if the height was lowered in regular competition. so less boats would have problems getting on plane. but leave it the same for kilos? so that the kilo speeds would not be reduced. is this a stupid idea?

[ricochet112]

The OMC restrictor plate needs to be increased for AXS for it to be a class with good parity, to match the Merc. We won't be running AXS next year, not much anyway, but to be fair to the newbies, it should be increased.

Is anyone out there planning on submitting a proposal like this?

[nicf14]

Instead of increasing speed in the omc, they should decrease the speed of the merc in J and axs.

[csh2z]

I agree with Nick. The OMC is not competitive. I also agree with Kev. Drop them all 3/8".

[nicf14]

I agree with Nick. The OMC is not competitive. I also agree with Kev. Drop them all 3/8".

The Brown checkers already have a pin @ 1 3/4" for Kpro.

[ian]

I agree. If J and AX speeds creep up with each new motor, theoretically we will have 110 MPH J's in 60 years. Well, that, and I just spent a bunch of money on some OMC stuff.....110 MPH J's.....think of the children!!!

[RShane]

Here is an example

here is a thought:
what if the height was lowered in regular competition. so less boats would have problems getting on plane. but leave it the same for kilos? so that the kilo speeds would not be reduced. is this a stupid idea?

SAFETY Rule 4 • Engine Mounting Heights
1. The following classes have limitations on where the engine’s propshaft may be mounted. The propshaft location shall be the distance between the center of the propshaft at its aft end, and the “planing surface” (as defined under SO Hulls unless otherwise stated in category technical rules). The measurement of the engine height shall be “as raced” with the engine turned straight (propshaft in-line with the fore-aft centerline of the boat). With the exception of JH, JR, AXSH, AXSR, and KPH, this rule does not apply to boats running in Kilo Trials.
Class Propshaft Depth Class Propshaft Depth
JH . . . . . . . . . . . . 1-3/8” 1 3/8" 1" Race 1 3/8" Depth for Kilo
JR . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1-3/8”1 3/8" 1" Race 1 3/8" Depth for Kilo

Red denotes a deletion from existing Blue Denotes the change

Now State Your Reason Why

[sam]

I agree. If J and AX speeds creep up with each new motor, theoretically we will have 110 MPH J's in 60 years. Well, that, and I just spent a bunch of money on some OMC stuff.....110 MPH J's.....think of the children!!!

Ian is correct ... original J speeds were in the 20's and many a veteran racer still has fond memories of those times

[Kev43V]

hmmm the way i read your post you went the wrong way. I believe you just RAISED the motor 3/8 of an inch in your example of a proposal. if that were implemented i feel that even more J drivers would be left trying to get on plane at the start of races. The point is to reduce the number of boats not getting on plane. To often i see boats that get on plane in testing but when the actual race starts they are not able to do so. That leaves me believing that the pit crew boss (dad?) is trying to get a little more out of the setup when they actually race than they did in testing. while it is frustrating to everyone from patrol boat drivers to the people waiting in their boats for the next heat. It has to be especially frustrating to the young driver to ONCE AGAIN not get on plane for the race. OR we bring them back in again and again until the boat will finally get on plane. 45 minutes later the J class runs.There are times i feel we need to say NO you had testing time and were on plane. so if you can not get on plane by the white flag you are done. but yet i feel then we are penalizing the driver for a decision made by the dad.
So I feel the best option is to lower the legal height to one that pretty much every boat will get on plane every time. but i would not want to do the same to the kilo rules because I do not think there would ever be a new record that way.

[Susan Rautenberg]

How many J's have problems planing with the 3blades?? In Region 10 we have about 13 J hydros and 8 J runabouts and dont seem to have that big of an issue. If one doesnt get on plane-the results have been engine problems or greedy pit crew going for a drastic set-up change. We put two boats out there in J from our camp and one of them was a planing problem more than any other out there. BUT this was because I have a driver who weighs 60lbs and has 50lbs of lead in a boat we inset the transom in for "A". I stick our other driver in the boat same set up-who weighs 95 lbs and has 15lbs of lead--gets on plane. What did I do-- switched boats and wow--no problems since!!! I could move the transom back now knowing what I have learned. Sometimes you have to adjust your set-up per driver. Im against changing the height and making everyone else have to now change set ups not to mention what to do with records etc........ I dont see it being a huge dilemma at least not out here.

[Skoontz]

We can plane every time with our Dewald J test prop, as soon as we bolt on the required APBA black props, the boat will not plane with the exact same set up as evidenced 3 times.


I would like to see two things. Make one set of J boat specifications with no variables allowed. That design would be taken from a design that works, like Sorrenson Woodcraft J boats.
Adopt those specifications and you would have until 2012 to make your boat conform, or buy another boat, or DQ. In those specs, make illegal, inset transoms, which I think has been a huge part of our planing issues along with the next proposal below.


Enforce the rule listed below:

Saftey Rule 6, testing. JH and JR as well as KPH, MUST be given separate test time, aside from other classes.

Sanction any promoter or race committee that denies J rigs test time if they ask for it. Sanctions would be something like giving back double the entry fees of that J team if they were denied test time. To validate this, they would have to ask their drivers rep to put in for the time.
There would also have to be a reasonable test time limit given, to be fair to the other racers, and since we were never really given that test time, someone who could define reasonable might chime in here if they think this is a good idea.



Further, start a J mentor program. I know many clubs have them.


So, ideally, both proposed changes, but, I would settle for enforcement of the testing time.

The reason for the change(s) If you want to keep newbies interested, they should run a boat that is proven and known to plane. i can only site our own experiences, but, grateful as we are for all given, we were given an A boat, and told it would be a GREAT J boat. when we replaced it, we bought a new A boat, and told it would work well in J class. Inset transoms killed us, I feel, and by adopting one spec, you truly have removed any advantage a boat could give in the class.

Reason for sanctions for not giving the test time the rule book says must be given...Simple. If a newbie or even someone in the learn is denied that water time to make sure the black prop works, and their boat does not plane, why should they have to pay for the heat? Double the money back would force promoters do follow the rules, and give back to the racer who could not do what they attended the race to do, that is race.....



That's it....

[Kev43V]

in our region we nearly (if not)always give time as soon as the ambulance is there. usually 1/2 hr. this is after the drivers meeting so the drivers have their APBA props.

[Fast Jack]

j Class

We have gone from NO js in region 1 to average of 5 boats at our races. I feel that the rules for competition are fare. We have both OMC and Mercs being raced and there is no clear advantage by either. I would like to keep the cost in line on the engines. There seems to be a good supply of used fishing engines available that can be converted to racing specs. I am still an advocate of allowing non performance parts ( steering bars , throttle linkage) to be manufactured by anyone ,and only subject to safety inspection. I just got a throttle set up for an engine we are converting and it was $ 171.00. There are other proven set ups available for far less. We give the J class a chance ,before their 1st heat to go out and get on plane, as soon as they do they come around the pins and come back in . If they need to change props they get another chance,after that if they do not get on plane during the heat races they are out. We have boats that are 10-15 years old being run competatively, Trying to make all the boats the same is a expense that we do not need in a class that is for entry level drivers .

[Skoontz]

Jack:

Agreed, if water time is given to test...Thus, part 2 of the proposal....