Why the pickel fork

[David Weaver]

I remember that Boat

I do not know who origionated the "pickle fork" design but I doubt it was the in the unlimited catagory. Bob Thorton, from Virginia, had an Evinrude PR running on what he called a "lobster boat" back in the 50's. There were a few other similar boats kicking around about then. Maybe Craig Bowman could supply some more detailed history.

Phil,

Bob ran that boat into the 70's. I could never tell if it was originally designed as a pckle fork or if the appearance was the result of an accident and subsequent repair.

DW

[hydroman6]

It would be cool to see a pic of the Marcell Hydro, if anyone had one. I would bet it would be competitive today as well. Always wondered what the Marcell Family is doing today. .

Marcell's rig from the 81? Dayton Nats. The only shot I could find. We pitted next to them. Great people.

Tom won his elim in A, only to be 1lb light.

When she found we were from the desert of Washington (60 miles from Moses Lake) Sue had 2 questions:

1. Did we have tumble weeds, &

2. "How do they do that" refering to 'tumbling' or rolling.

We offered to box one up and ship it to her house, but dad said no way!

[f8andbethere]

Pickleforks

Well, first of all, the Rolls Royce Merlin was a 12 cylinder engine that was used by unlimited through the 1980s when the turbines began to take over. There is still one team that uses the American version of the engine build by Allison.

The unlimiteds started using the picklefork in the late 1960s and early 1970s. Some of these pickleforks were just "cutouts" of the round nose wherein the team was trying to resolve the blow over issue (see slo mo V) and then there was some research done and a boat called Myr's Sheet Metal Special or something like that came out and it was totally swoopy back in the day (maybe 1972.)

From there it was really a Ron Jones, Ed Karelsen, Jon Staudacher show with those guys building the majority of boats for inboard hydro and unlimited classes.

In the Outboard classes, I believe it was Tim Butts who really ran the first true picklefork hydro in the pro class. He did his testing via theory from the text book and then testing on the lake. He won several nationals and his designs, particularly for pro boats, were way ahead of the typical pro boats of the day.

They were copied but never I don't think anyone ever really duplicated the "secret sauce" that he put into these craft.

In the end, I believe that you will find that the aerodynamics were superior for the pickeforks, particularly at the higher speeds of the pro boats.

I do remember that Steve Vincent has a potent B Stock Hydro / 25SS Hydro boat that he designed and I am not sure who built it, but it was fast (may national champion in 25 hydro in 82) that was a round nose.

f/8

[Rich Russo]

Wow! Thanks for posting the picture!

[sam]

Thorton, Swift and DeSilva all built pickleforks in the 1950's. I don't know about the plan on Thornton's "Lobster Boat" but most of the older Region 4 guys remember it. Big Dave Augustine recalls driving it once late in its life when "it was probably only held together with castor oil gum". I asked the Bowman brothers about it and that is all they remember about it too.

The Swift and the DeSilva were both built as pickleforks on purpose

[Inside Lane]

Steve Vincent

Well, first of all, the Rolls Royce Merlin was a 12 cylinder engine that was used by unlimited through the 1980s when the turbines began to take over. There is still one team that uses the American version of the engine build by Allison.

The unlimiteds started using the picklefork in the late 1960s and early 1970s. Some of these pickleforks were just "cutouts" of the round nose wherein the team was trying to resolve the blow over issue (see slo mo V) and then there was some research done and a boat called Myr's Sheet Metal Special or something like that came out and it was totally swoopy back in the day (maybe 1972.)

From there it was really a Ron Jones, Ed Karelsen, Jon Staudacher show with those guys building the majority of boats for inboard hydro and unlimited classes.

In the Outboard classes, I believe it was Tim Butts who really ran the first true picklefork hydro in the pro class. He did his testing via theory from the text book and then testing on the lake. He won several nationals and his designs, particularly for pro boats, were way ahead of the typical pro boats of the day.

They were copied but never I don't think anyone ever really duplicated the "secret sauce" that he put into these craft.

In the end, I believe that you will find that the aerodynamics were superior for the pickeforks, particularly at the higher speeds of the pro boats.

I do remember that Steve Vincent has a potent B Stock Hydro / 25SS Hydro boat that he designed and I am not sure who built it, but it was fast (may national champion in 25 hydro in 82) that was a round nose.

f/8

Steve Vincent had a round nose at the 1976 Nationals that had deck traps. The boat was built by Steve Straith in Seattle. He ran it in BSH. The boat was named Mr. Wizzard,

In 82, 83, 84 Steve ran a couple of Dart Craft Pickle forks build by Dewey Anderson in Seattle, Washington.

Those boats were super fast. Just taking my 15SS off of my boat and putting it on Steves Dart Craft I picked up 2 MPH. It went around the corners like it was on rails!

The 25 Dart Craft was sold to a guy on the Oregon Coast and burned up in a fire. The B Dart Craft is owned by a mutual friend and in in storage in Seattle.

[Inside Lane]

That it!

Marcell's rig from the 81? Dayton Nats. The only shot I could find. We pitted next to them. Great people.

Tom won his elim in A, only to be 1lb light.

When she found we were from the desert of Washington (60 miles from Moses Lake) Sue had 2 questions:

1. Did we have tumble weeds, &

2. "How do they do that" refering to 'tumbling' or rolling.

We offered to box one up and ship it to her house, but dad said no way!

That is THE boat! I remember Tom would "wear" the boat rather than "get in" it.

[Freedom Fighter]

Picklebout

Who build the first stock outboard Picklebout? (Picklefork runnabout.)

[PopPop]

Just a note of interest ??

I just left my son Philip's house (Christmas eve dinner) and told him about the "pickle-fork" discussion on Hydroracer. We reminesed about Bob Thorton taking him for a ride in his "lobster boat"/PR, in Collingswood, NJ, before he was old enough to run J. Philip has never forgotten it. Who could ever forget "Thorney". With Nickie Wyeth, I could tell you stories about Thorton that you can't publish here on Hydroracer.

[aojesus]

Marcell boats

Joey and I were at Tom Cronk's yesterday playing with a motor and we re-lived some of the 70's. Included in those memories was a race at Saranac Lake when a certain Marcell JSH (name withheld to protect the driver ) came out of the turn and disappeared. The driver went under a boat house during the race. Needless to say there were a lot of nervous people until word got back to the pits that the driver was O.K. I don't recall how bad the boat was hurt.

Does anybody remember this incident?

[Rich Russo]

Saranac Lake

Was that at the Nats at Lake Flower, 1976?? Trying to remember. During that week, I bought a $25 prop (which is still have) from the McNeil`s for my ASR, He couldn`t pass me, and I won my elimination heat, only to be DQ`d for coming in before the yellow flag?? Oh well. If you can see in my avatar pic, My Dawecraft CSH has a square nose. Does anyone remember when that design first came out??? I`m pretty sure Ernie Dawe was the first.

[aojesus]

1976

Was that at the Nats at Lake Flower, 1976?? Trying to remember. During that week, I bought a $25 prop (which is still have) from the McNeil`s for my ASR, He couldn`t pass me, and I won my elimination heat, only to be DQ`d for coming in before the yellow flag?? Oh well. If you can see in my avatar pic, My Dawecraft CSH has a square nose. Does anyone remember when that design first came out??? I`m pretty sure Ernie Dawe was the first.

I believe it was 1975 or 1976.
As far as square noses,... I have no idea. I used to run a Bunky in ASH in Canada in 1979 that had a square nose. It belonged to Barry Crane.

[T Chance]

I remember a couple things about Pickle Fork hydros. In the late 50's or early 60's The Kaus' brothers from Austin, Minnesota had their runabouts built by their uncle Emmett. One day Emmett brought a D alky hydro to a race for someone to try. He was made fun of and no one would put a motor on it. finally the referee stated the boat was of dangerous construction and would not allow it on the water. You guessed it, he had built a pickle fork, and we never saw uncle Em at a race again.

In the early 70's Tim Butts got similar treatment with statements like "Did you run out of time to finish building the boat?" But within a couple of years nearly everyone in the Pro Division had a pickle fork.

I took this photo of Tim Butts with his Butts Aerowing at Lakeland, Florida in the Spring of 1971.

[Inside Lane]

Square nose

Was that at the Nats at Lake Flower, 1976?? Trying to remember. During that week, I bought a $25 prop (which is still have) from the McNeil`s for my ASR, He couldn`t pass me, and I won my elimination heat, only to be DQ`d for coming in before the yellow flag?? Oh well. If you can see in my avatar pic, My Dawecraft CSH has a square nose. Does anyone remember when that design first came out??? I`m pretty sure Ernie Dawe was the first.

In 1972 we built our first square nose hydro, Blimp Craft, we ran it in Cedar Rapids, Iowa Nationals in ASH. The next Square nose we built in 1975 I placed third in 15SSH at Dayton in 1979. Mark Demaray, MD hulls, built a square nose in 1976 and ran it at Hinton West Virginian in ASH. In 1980 we built our third square nose for my brother and He ran it in ASH in the Northwest. After that we went to Pickle forks.

[hydroman6]

Skeet Phillips sent me this old photo, angin from the '80 ?? Nats in Dayton of the Marcell kids and Jeff Reins in my DSH. Pete