Is 45SS a Stock class?

[propnuts]

Stock, Mod & Pro rule book 23.4.1 (d) says "There shall be no other Stock Outboard race sanctioned within the same geographic Division on the same dates as the Stock Outboard Divisional or National Championship". In another thread one of the racers mentioned that there is a race scheduled in CA the same weekend as Nats. This would indicate to me that don't consider themselves part of the catagory. To give them special scheduling consideration at Nats seems like the complete wrong thing to do. One of the racers from there posted a list of reasons why they won't come to Nats anyway, even if it is in the same division . Doesn't sound like a Stock class to me. Tony

[Ron Hill]

The 2007 Long Beach Sprint Nationals Will Be OPC

The WFLS are all run under the banner of OPC.

[mercguy]

your right Tony.......

Stock, Mod & Pro rule book 23.4.1 (d) says "There shall be no other Stock Outboard race sanctioned within the same geographic Division on the same dates as the Stock Outboard Divisional or National Championship". In another thread one of the racers mentioned that there is a race scheduled in CA the same weekend as Nats. This would indicate to me that don't consider themselves part of the catagory. To give them special scheduling consideration at Nats seems like the complete wrong thing to do. One of the racers from there posted a list of reasons why they won't come to Nats anyway, even if it is in the same division . Doesn't sound like a Stock class to me. Tony

they could not run 45SS the same weekend, but SST45 they can and will, which are both essentially the same class. With a small turnout of 45SS's at the Nationals, that would really put a knife in the existance of the class. I imagine Ernie Dawe, Bill Boyes and Joe Johnson are going to do what ever possible to get these drivers to show up, if they want the class to remain in existance. Maybe Ron will form his own 45 series with all the rigs he owns......

[mercguy]

The WFLS are all run under the banner of OPC.

but, the 45SS class could not be ran during that event Ron.

[Tomtall]

Why Not?

45ss is a stock outboard catigory class. SST45 is a OPC catigory class.
I don't see why they conflict. This is the mess you get into when factorys get involved to promote the sales of their new motors and try and get more sales by making a flip'n OPC class motor and boat be able to run under the stock outboard catigory. Sorry but it's not right and the 45ss class should go bye bye.

[mercguy]

what is the problem??

who is it hurting, having the 45SS class?? Is the class causing issues with someone............not! Leave the class alone, even if it is only ran on the West Coast. It is the same issue as BSR or BSH, they are only ran on the east coast. So, in logic, all west coast racers should request those classes to be eliminated also.......right? I remember not too long ago of talk of eliminating the DSH class also, but as people can see, it has a resurgance happening right now, especially on the west coast (thanks to the Bass Tohatsu!).

[jpro60]

Just playing devils advocate

Hey, I don't really mind 45's being in stock... I don't get it, but I don't mind it.
As far as the question of how does it hurt, I'll play devils advocate real quick. I do think it kind of hurts not the category, but the outboard race day. That is to say that outboard races are already a crunch as is to fit everything in and throwing 45's in the mix doesn't help matters. What I have observed at races in Washington is that it takes a large portion of the day to run the 45's. You have to completely clear all of the other boats from the ramp, then launch the 45's one at a time (a slow process) wait for them all to get launched, then run their two heats, then go through the entire one at a time process to get them back out.
All I'm really trying to say is that running 45's takes up a chunk of the day that I'm not sure needs to be taken up.

Mike 32-R

[Gordie Miller]

Times may have changed but...........

there was several reasons why the class was set up to run in BOTH categories. I personally ran the class in both categories for almost 15 years. Tom, I'm a little disappointed in your narrowminded view on it, especially since you quit racing shortly after the class was introduced. I don't see how it affects you regardless. If anyone would like to know the story I'd be glad to share on the phone, I type WAY too slow to post it. I can be reached at 847-830-8061.

[mercguy]

ah.........

Hey, I don't really mind 45's being in stock... I don't get it, but I don't mind it.
As far as the question of how does it hurt, I'll play devils advocate real quick. I do think it kind of hurts not the category, but the outboard race day. That is to say that outboard races are already a crunch as is to fit everything in and throwing 45's in the mix doesn't help matters. What I have observed at races in Washington is that it takes a large portion of the day to run the 45's. You have to completely clear all of the other boats from the ramp, then launch the 45's one at a time (a slow process) wait for them all to get launched, then run their two heats, then go through the entire one at a time process to get them back out.
All I'm really trying to say is that running 45's takes up a chunk of the day that I'm not sure needs to be taken up.

Mike 32-R

c'mon Mike, the 45's have just as much right to race as the rest of us. Actually, it is kind of nice having them, as it does give the rest of us a "short break" in between racing heats (and opportunity to get a bite to eat or take a leak). I do not think their delays are any worse than let's say, a mod or pro (stocker too, for that matter) going out and breaking down prior to the start and needing towed back in. There are other delays that usually cause the race day to get longer and mostly not from the race course happenings......

[Tomtall]

45ss

Ok lets back up here. The original post was from what I read was regarding the conflict of a OPC race on the west coast that would be running a race when the stock nationals would be running their race which included 45ss class. The question was if it was in conflic with the APBA rules regarding no other stock race could be run during the stock outboard nationals race. There should be no conflict acording to the rules because one is a OPC catigory race and the other is a stock race. Which I believe Ron Hill was trying to get across. I do see how it could affect 45ss partisapation at the stock nationals. However, this is no reason for the conducting club holding the OPC race to have to cancel that race. Maybe I am not interpreting the rule correctly. Correct me if I'm not.
Secondly, on my venting of the 45ss class as a stock class your absolutly correct in saying that I have no interest because I don't race it. That dosn't mean that I can't exspress my own views on why I feel it's dosn't really fit todays stock outboard format. It's the only capsul tunnel hull that runs in stock. It was my understanding when the OMC 45 was introduced that it would be great to be able to showcase the motor as much as possible to help the class grow. It worked. 45 sst took off very well and the stock races were able to have the 45's show up at their races to put on a show as the big class of the day. I saw things happen though at many stock races as time went on that were not cool when it came to the 45ss class racing at stock race sites. Both concerned saftey issues. One- many of the stock races were held on rivers with shallow bottoms. Not good when a capsule boat blows over and has it's canopy hatch stuck in the mud with the driver traped inside.Two- Many of the stock rescue crews at the time had no capsule rescue training other than a quick go over of the capsule layout just hours before a race was run. I think we were lucky that more drivers didn't get hurt.
I still feel that a 45ss class boat is best suited to run strictly in a catigory like OPC due to it's differences from a stock hydro or runabout boat and thier race format. I think the stock catigory has enough things going on as far as classes as not to have this class in its catigory as well. The engine was promoted in it's day, lets move on and look to stream line things a little to help our catigories grow and prosper. Just my feelings on the matter. Didn't mean to piss so many people off about the subject. God bless America and freedom of speech. Oh, and if you think I'm narrow minded I could really give a ****. I only really care about one persons opinion of me and hopefully I won't be meeting him for a while to discuss it.

[mercguy]

Ok lets back up here. The original post was from what I read was regarding the conflict of a OPC race on the west coast that would be running a race when the stock nationals would be running their race which included 45ss class. The question was if it was in conflic with the APBA rules regarding no other stock race could be run during the stock outboard nationals race. There should be no conflict acording to the rules because one is a OPC catigory race and the other is a stock race. Which I believe Ron Hill was trying to get across. I do see how it could affect 45ss partisapation at the stock nationals. However, this is no reason for the conducting club holding the OPC race to have to cancel that race. Maybe I am not interpreting the rule correctly. Correct me if I'm not.
Secondly, on my venting of the 45ss class as a stock class your absolutly correct in saying that I have no interest because I don't race it. That dosn't mean that I can't exspress my own views on why I feel it's dosn't really fit todays stock outboard format. It's the only capsul tunnel hull that runs in stock. It was my understanding when the OMC 45 was introduced that it would be great to be able to showcase the motor as much as possible to help the class grow. It worked. 45 sst took off very well and the stock races were able to have the 45's show up at their races to put on a show as the big class of the day. I saw things happen though at many stock races as time went on that were not cool when it came to the 45ss class racing at stock race sites. Both concerned saftey issues. One- many of the stock races were held on rivers with shallow bottoms. Not good when a capsule boat blows over and has it's canopy hatch stuck in the mud with the driver traped inside.Two- Many of the stock rescue crews at the time had no capsule rescue training other than a quick go over of the capsule layout just hours before a race was run. I think we were lucky that more drivers didn't get hurt.
I still feel that a 45ss class boat is best suited to run strictly in a catigory like OPC due to it's differences from a stock hydro or runabout boat and thier race format. I think the stock catigory has enough things going on as far as classes as not to have this class in its catigory as well. The engine was promoted in it's day, lets move on and look to stream line things a little to help our catigories grow and prosper. Just my feelings on the matter. Didn't mean to piss so many people off about the subject. God bless America and freedom of speech. Oh, and if you think I'm narrow minded I could really give a ****. I only really care about one persons opinion of me and hopefully I won't be meeting him for a while to discuss it.

Tom, I did not say that the Reg12 OPC race (SST45) would have to be cancelled, but they are "by rule" not allowed to run the 45SS class the same weekend (which is what Tony quoted), since the Nationals are being ran that week. Although the OPC class is the "series race" for SCSC (and more prestigeous), so highly doubt there will be a problem. Also, 45SS and 45SST race on 2 different type courses. The SS class races on a more SO type course, along with the starts. Keep in mind, Ron was the one that requested the 45SS class for the Nationals.....

actually I need to keep my nose out of this topic, as I am not a current 45 racer (but plan to a couple times this season).......

[Ron Hill]

I Requested Wednesday...

Actually, I'd be glad to have the 45 SS Nationals at Parker in April. hey, the 45 SS Nationals, were awarded to Washington. Ernie Dawe actually requested that 45's run early in the week...I just posted his request to RACERDAVEDSH. After going to Parker, last weekend, I didn't get a very warm reception when I asked if anyone was going to the Nationals in Washington....

Chad didn't go to Parker, so he had no influence on the drivers at Parker Several teams just said, "WOW, driver for two days race one day and drive for two days to get back in time for Long Beach...Hmmmm....Long Beach is a BIG RACE (Nice location, TV coverage, SPECTATORS, CLASSIC BOAT SHOW, GREAT RACING, MAJOR PARTIES) and a month later, San Diego is a HUGE race. (The Unlimiteds draw about 400,000 for the week, when we race 45's, we have to fight our way through the people to get down to help our boats start...We race 45 laps at San Diego...The Stock Nationals will be six laps...)...

The Cracker Box Club is basically a Regin 12 CLUB, but they have had 13-16 boats at every race this year......They seem to have "GROUP THINK" and support every REGION 12 race.....trust me, they could afford to travel, but they like racing in SoCal....2 Bakersfield Races, Long Beach, San Diego (FYI: Long Beach and San Diego ARE SALT WATER)...2 Parker races....Burley, Idaho..7 races a year......One road trip to Burley...

Truth is, GOOD BOAT RACING doesn't require driving 3,000 miles...

[DougMc]

Man, this food fight is getting almost, almost but not quite, as good as the recent Pro food fight. Those boys know how to dust it up.

I got my rule book in the mail yesterday. It was not clear, but can the stock div 45SS run on a hydro?

[rossdbos]

Here's my take

As a former National Champion and National High Point champion in the 45SS class and now a full time promoter for the sport I can tell you that having it in both categories only adds to the "more bang for your buck" philosophy of boat racing. It's helped spur growth and gotten alot of new racers on the West Coast and other parts of the country into boat racing.

Here's one of the great reasons: If you can show up, pay your entry fees and race the same boat for two sets of national high points in two different categories then why not. Isn't it the point to attract more racers rather than alienate racers and whose to say what "fit's and what belongs and doesn't" if the SORC deems that they don't need the entries or membership and wish to hurt the promoters then so be it but it only hurts the racers and if I understand some of the commentary, that's a good thing?

The 45 SS motor was the nexus for the original class that never made it as a hydro class but adapted to the tunnel boat configuration. So it took off in a hull that wasn't a "hydro" or "runabout" but the motor was "stock" from the factory. The SST-45 class / 45SS class not only is thriving but GROWING on the West Coast and this from a "dead motor" class -the motor ceased to be built in the early 1990's not long before OMC went under.

So let's look at it from an angle of how to grow the sport instead of keeping it "our little secret". Anything that will help the racers and promoters and willl add to the overall sport itself is a good thing in my estimation!

Do with the class as you will, it matters not as I am truly tired of fighting the SORC, namely a few on the commission that feel it's better for the sake of the sport to purge the category of the wretched tunnel boat!

Ross Wallach, RPM RACING ENT./SCSC

[propnuts]

45SS Nationals?

Actually, I'd be glad to have the 45 SS Nationals at Parker in April. .

This was the point of my original post, I don't think these racers consider THEMSELVES part of the Stock catagory. One of the problems I have with that is that Wayne Peeters has been trying to grow the class here in region 10, as a stock class. If he can't get guys in his own division to show up for Nationals, especially because it conflicts with another race, I don't see how you build any momentum for the class. I understand that the OPC race doesn't violate the stock rules, but it sure seems to be a slap in the face to the SPIRIT of the rule.

I also agree with Gomer and disagree with that other kid , I think the break we get with the 45's is nice, and the fact that they can run back to back make up for any inconvenience. What someone else posted is also true, after a day of watching the SAME boats with different weights and restrictors run around, the 45's are a very spectator friendly, visually pleasing break.