Miss my old APBA class

[MGallagher]

Daren, the question still remains. Proof please? Big manufacturers do not produce strictly racing motors. And who knows, someone might have tried it and it work, only on small outboards that race turning left at high RPM, but there wasn't a market for it and/or were shunned because someone said it would never work. With respect to your friend, that's not proof.

Pertaining to price and performance. First, those two companies were done with you after they got you to buy the motor. The Yamato is used, the omc needed work to run fast, and the hot rod needed tons of work to get the 2 mph and punch that everyone else had. No, its not perfect, yes our sports been dying, or I'm sorry, migrating back and forth across the country, but its been on a downward trajectory up until about 4 or 5 years ago where it seemed to stabilize, Dholt will help me out on those numbers.

[kev29p]

Mercguy

OMC/bombardier mass produced this -

[mercguy]

OMC/bombardier mass produced this -

a true looper and designed correctly.............not just a side mounted carb.....

[MGallagher]

Wow. That's weird?

[pav225]

?

Lets quit picking and get back to Dana's suggestion and think of ways to grow the sport...

Could you restrict a 20 ci Hot Rod and have it compete with the 20 ci Sidewinder? Then you could offer a new motor and a low cost option to get folks into the class.

Thoughts??

[mercguy]

Daren, the question still remains. Proof please? Big manufacturers do not produce strictly racing motors. And who knows, someone might have tried it and it work, only on small outboards that race turning left at high RPM, but there wasn't a market for it and/or were shunned because someone said it would never work. With respect to your friend, that's not proof.

Pertaining to price and performance. First, those two companies were done with you after they got you to buy the motor. The Yamato is used, the omc needed work to run fast, and the hot rod needed tons of work to get the 2 mph and punch that everyone else had. No, its not perfect, yes our sports been dying, or I'm sorry, migrating back and forth across the country, but its been on a downward trajectory up until about 4 or 5 years ago where it seemed to stabilize, Dholt will help me out on those numbers.

Matt, you are wrong............Mercury STILL produces a TRUE V6 race motor......and are very good at it.......and stand behind them with factory support.

is the SW Co giving all the current owners all new intake manifolds (and carbs) without charging them or do they have to pay for it????

I would rather buy (2) USED Yamato's than (1) new SW at the current state of the SW engine............and still be able to start the engine IN THE WATER......

I'm outta here...............got some motors to get ready for this coming weekends 1/4mile and KILO records race in Oregon.....................hope to see some of those RELIABLE and FAST Sidewinders........

as to knowing who Ron Anderson is Matt..............here is some good reading....

http://www.boatracingfacts.com/forum...6-Ron-Anderson

he also builds most of the Mercury V6 racing engines for the Qatar race team and crew chief......so, he MUST know what he is doing, as they pay him big bucks to do so....

[mercguy]

Wow. That's weird?

how many of those OMC 60degree V6's have you rebuilt or had apart?? I have rebuilt lots of them....

[mercguy]

Lets quit picking and get back to Dana's suggestion and think of ways to grow the sport...

Could you restrict a 20 ci Hot Rod and have it compete with the 20 ci Sidewinder? Then you could offer a new motor and a low cost option to get folks into the class.

Thoughts??

well said Mike, sorry to have interjected in the conversation, in regards to the SW......let's move on........

go Tohatsu!!!!

[MGallagher]

I'm sure mercury does, but none of those V6 blocks are used for production, non racing motors? And of course they are going to support $$$ like that. Not sure about the SideWinder arrangement on part changes. Congrats on all your Yamato purchases, but I've lifted more Hot Rods, than SideWinders. Mike Young asked me at Lock Haven "whos gonna help lift", and I got to say, "nobody, your good like that."
And I know your not "outta here," your reading this right now. So, good luck at Kilos and be careful with all that snow you guys are getting. And I too, hope you see a Reliable, Fast SideWinder blister some Kilo runs.

[Gunjumper]

After many heats of racing a Sidewinder in the last few years with both ups and downs, I pulled the plug on racing for a bit to do the family thing. I recently raced A and B runabout at Lock Haven and not only did the motor perform flawlessly and start in the water, it was a snappy consistent engine the whole weekend. I ran deck to deck with (and beat) from what I am told was the fastest OMC at the Nats and the same with a top Hot Rod B contender as well. For the record I had one heat with hiccups and it was some crud in the fuel filter which was from the tank and not Sidewinder related. I ran with the best, consistently, and beat them straight up about half the time... all with a Sidewinder on the transom. Proof. Period. Greg Lyons

[Apachemax]

Good idea on paper...

Lets quit picking and get back to Dana's suggestion and think of ways to grow the sport...

Could you restrict a 20 ci Hot Rod and have it compete with the 20 ci Sidewinder? Then you could offer a new motor and a low cost option to get folks into the class.

Thoughts??

I see your reasoning behind this.
But 15ss got renamed B because the 20ci Hot Rod is EXTREMELY temperamental.
The only way i see it is pulling the 20SW out of B, but good luck doing that now that a fair majority of B drivers own 20SWs.
This class got pretty jacked up, i wish someone would have come along with a modern revision of the Hot Rod. As far as im concerned, the Hot Rod could be made into a very user friendly motor, with some minor manufacturing changes. But now that we have the sidewinder, thats all out of the question i guess.
Lets resolve this, in a timely fashion, before our sport dwindles to nothing.

[Blackhawkguy]

Side mounted carbs no good?

Ummm-sorry to disagree but every snowmobile engine made has side mounted intake system-motor just sits upright in stead of on its side-your barking down the wrong trail-maybe needs some fine tuning but doubt this is a real problem.

Just saying.

Kerry

And before anyone responds- my 1998 Arctic Cat Snow Pro race sled was a real pig till we figured out the jetting-factory had several updates to help fix the problem-so this is not limited to the SideWinder-it took an EGT gauge for me to get it right-all the issues where in the size of the tube coming from the float bowl and the slide needle valve and slide angle all located in the carburetor-all these sleds are rushed into production so they can make their 500 build requirement and they usually have allot of fine tuning to do-being part of the factory race team means sending data back to the factory so they can pass on the information to the other racers who also have the same equipment-by sharing data the problem gets fixed quickly

KH

[18W]

I think you guys are missing the point here. The class is now being morphed into another Yamato speed class. Now I agree with Scott Reed, how many of similar speed classes do we need? I would say it is pretty apparent that the data is there for the committee to realize that they may have to adjust something to achieve somewhat of proximity of parity.
I'm hoping they used testing data to decide that a 20 cubic inch motor with a restrictor is equal to a 15 cubic inch motor unrestricted, instead of arbitrarily choosing a restrictor size. Now they have hard race and record data to reference.

[MGallagher]

60 mph is more realistic speeds for BSR. That 65 speed looked like it was established with a non-compitition boat, a side-fin mounted(removed) ASR/AXSR. And wasn't the old BSR's running 65mph.

[D_Allen_III]

Matt,
Bobby Austin set the BSR record at 65. I'm pretty sure it was his competition setup, unless he has 2 boats painted very similar. I don't believe he owns or was using an ASR boat, but could be wrong.