SO class reduction proposal, lithium version

[raceright]

Pro-Motion,

How do you know that? What arguments are you basing your "quip" on?

I point to the Pro Category as the model SO is following. The Pro-Category has suffered the largest % membership declines of any of the categories over the last 3 decades. Take out your OSY400 numbers and take a hard look at the data. Pro Racing is the coolest ride to watch and the USTS races are as good as it gets, but your Category has been reduced to a small group of dedicated die hard racers that compete in a top notch national series.

Stock Outboard is heading down the exact same path. If that path is what we want, that is fine, but I believe in local racing! I think it is critical to "new name" membership growth. Selling an 6-8K rig to a new person who can race it 5-6 weekends within 3-4 hours of home seems a lot easier than selling the idea of racing 8-10 times around the Nation.

From my point of view the Pro-category is "evidenced proof" of what will happen to SO racing. I think it will exist in ten years, but it will be a handful of people racing at a dozen big races a year around the county.

Dean
12M

You got it Dean main reason I yell so loud as stockoutboard goes so does all powerboatracing even more so the growth of Mod And Pro

To many of ya are only interested in your own self and this will be the death---ya talk classes --engines ---who can run with who
This has all been tried over and over FOR YOU guys under 40 believe you me all the class restructuring has been done over and over and here we are less and less of us.

Doug is serious about shelfing his 25 I know him and he would do it if it makes stockouboard better. HOW MANY OF YOU WOULD DO THE SAME FOR THE BETTERMENT OF POWERBOAT RACING.

[guedo499]

25xs

I just built a 25xs; built 3 hydro and 2 runabout props to go with it. I'll put them on the shelf and in the showroom for the betterment of the sport.

[14J]

I think it is needed because we are dividing up 200 drivers (that race over three weekends) across 11 classes. We are dividing the pie up into to many pieces. We have diluted the pool to the point that it almost is not feasible, from cost, competition, and fun.

Dean-

I strongly agree with this part of your statement.

To the Masses -

It’s equally important that we address our value proposition. A realignment will have a trickledown effect. It will foster class density and more competitive race fields. It will allow for different heat formats, multiple race days, special events, etc.

What kills me about our sport is the cost/benefit equation. From “My Perspective” this is a hobby and I invest accordingly. I own (1) Yamato rig, 5 or so props, and a small enclosed trailer. I have more than 10k invested in a competitive rig. Now because of my size 20SSH is not viable for me, I race CSH only (don’t touch this one captain). What do I get out of the weekend after driving 4-5 hours after work on a Friday? A total of 6 laps per day and in the case of CSH I might only get 1 elimination heat. If I want more water time I have to drop another 5k,10k, maybe 15k on a second class. This math doesn’t makes sense to me, my bank account, my retirement plans, or my family's welfare.

So I’ll say it again “It’s equally important that we address our value proposition”.

[blueskyracer]

Dean-

I strongly agree with this part of your statement.

To the Masses -


What do I get out of the weekend after driving 4-5 hours after work on a Friday? A total of 6 laps per day and in the case of CSH I might only get 1 elimination heat. If I want more water time I have to drop another 5k,10k, maybe 15k on a second class. This math doesn’t makes sense to me, my bank account, my retirement plans, or my family's welfare.

So I’ll say it again “It’s equally important that we address our value proposition”.

That says it all for a lot of us!!

[csh12M]

I just built a 25xs; built 3 hydro and 2 runabout props to go with it. I'll put them on the shelf and in the showroom for the betterment of the sport.

John,

Really? Did you really build a 25XS rig? I am not trying to be critical if you did, but I would like to understand why? You are exactly the size and weight for BSH with a Sidewinder.

Again, not trying to sound harsh, but this is the type of situation I am referencing. Can you share with us why, 25XS and not a Sidewinder class.

Thanks for the input and the willingness to move the sport forward.

Dean
12M

[csh12M]

Value proposition!!!

Dean-

I strongly agree with this part of your statement.

To the Masses -

It’s equally important that we address our value proposition. A realignment will have a trickledown effect. It will foster class density and more competitive race fields. It will allow for different heat formats, multiple race days, special events, etc.

What kills me about our sport is the cost/benefit equation. From “My Perspective” this is a hobby and I invest accordingly. I own (1) Yamato rig, 5 or so props, and a small enclosed trailer. I have more than 10k invested in a competitive rig. Now because of my size 20SSH is not viable for me, I race CSH only (don’t touch this one captain). What do I get out of the weekend after driving 4-5 hours after work on a Friday? A total of 6 laps per day and in the case of CSH I might only get 1 elimination heat. If I want more water time I have to drop another 5k,10k, maybe 15k on a second class. This math doesn’t makes sense to me, my bank account, my retirement plans, or my family's welfare.

So I’ll say it again “It’s equally important that we address our value proposition”.

Singing to the choir! What I don't understand is why more people do not see this picture. Not only can we enhance the value proposition for the new name racer, we can enhance it for the existing racer! We can make this change while still keeping 90% of the equipment raced on the water. Additionally, if we can get the 25SSH into 400CCH then everyone still has a home.

[Big Don]

Dean-

I strongly agree with this part of your statement.

To the Masses -

It’s equally important that we address our value proposition. A realignment will have a trickledown effect. It will foster class density and more competitive race fields. It will allow for different heat formats, multiple race days, special events, etc.

What kills me about our sport is the cost/benefit equation. From “My Perspective” this is a hobby and I invest accordingly. I own (1) Yamato rig, 5 or so props, and a small enclosed trailer. I have more than 10k invested in a competitive rig. Now because of my size 20SSH is not viable for me, I race CSH only (don’t touch this one captain). What do I get out of the weekend after driving 4-5 hours after work on a Friday? A total of 6 laps per day and in the case of CSH I might only get 1 elimination heat. If I want more water time I have to drop another 5k,10k, maybe 15k on a second class. This math doesn’t makes sense to me, my bank account, my retirement plans, or my family's welfare.

So I’ll say it again “It’s equally important that we address our value proposition”.

Because I could not say it any better...I agree 100% with this...only difference is I think I own 6 props and maybe 2 engines.

I also like Dean proposal and think this is the right direction, it gives almost everyone a place to race and only eliminates possibly 1 engine.

[guedo499]

John,

Really? Did you really build a 25XS rig? I am not trying to be critical if you did, but I would like to understand why? You are exactly the size and weight for BSH with a Sidewinder.

Again, not trying to sound harsh, but this is the type of situation I am referencing. Can you share with us why, 25XS and not a Sidewinder class.

Thanks for the input and the willingness to move the sport forward.

Dean
12M

Well, to be specific, I didn't build anything...my father did with parts and help from Daren G and Jimi O. This wasn't built from complete scratch, but pretty close, but still doesn't compare in price to a new SW. I really wanted to put a 25 runabout together to go after Eddie (had soooo much fun this year holding him off at the Nats!) but a Yamato rig is almost too big for me... 25ssr is a up-and-coming class in Reg. 10.

Going to BSH with a SW is not in the plans for me. If your proposal goes through, I'll continue to race BSH with a restricted Yamato 302. Remember, I am in the Northwest where the only SW's (2) we have seen at a local races have struggled immensely AND if we want to, we can drive down the street to Montoya's and pick up a 302.

I do plan on purchasing an A SW, but I'm intimidated on the carb setup. Stock motors should error on the side of simplicity - I need a lot of convincing that the SWs are that way.

Oh, just a second, I need to check my reed heights in my 44xs....

4 days later...

Ok, the heights are good-to-go.

[Fast Jack]

Stock outboard

Region 1 has several races where we have spectators, a lot of em. As a 25 ssh racer I have had several people say they have a motor like mine at the camp or fishing rig in their garage. How often does that happen with a 302 ? I had a sailboater ask me if my C mod was a "Seagull "engine converted to racing.. Dean, are you really dead set against one of the few engines that actually looks "stock" compeating or are you trying to get a sidewinder in every garage? Who decided we should have 4 classes ? Keep 25 alive- it is a class that has close racing and people identify with the black motors..

[reed28n]

What?????

Because I could not say it any better...I agree 100% with this...only difference is I think I own 6 props and maybe 2 engines.

I also like Dean proposal and think this is the right direction, it gives almost everyone a place to race and only eliminates possibly 1 engine.

You have flipped. You couldn't wait to run me out and now you love the principles of what the SORC was doing 2 years ago....

and I think you own about 7 yamato 80's and I don't even want to guess how many props.

[reed28n]

Ps 2008

No motors were elimnated. Every motor had a class to race in.

I agree with Dean's general idea.....details are going to be difficult to sell but it is time for something to change....

The real challenge is the parity and the parity committees. The more motors you put in one class the longer it will take to get parity right. We will all be test drivers for a few years lobbying for our particular motor.

Parity can only achieve better racing and future growth if it favors new motors.

[Big Don]

Shouldn’t have taken the Merc out of A

I’m guessing you would be on your second term now.

Know of any good 80's for sale...looking for a 3rd one. See if you can talk Clark out of his for me. I'll take just the power head...

[53-W]

Dean,
Why are you so worried about the sidewinder and what classes to race it in? Almost every one I have seen has ran was off speed or did not start in the water or start 2 heats back to back! It still is an very an unproven engine in any form. They have had crank failure, locked up, not running or starting well from heat to heat, or weekend to weekend. You think this is are future of are sport and we should give them any class they want with a engine that has not shown any better reliability then even worst Hot-Rod.
They need to do a lot of testing and improvment to there product and prove that they really have a competitive engine and that they all run the same. Not have 3 fast ones and the other 30 guys get stuck with off speed stuff.
53W

[Gunjumper]

The reason you see only 3 Sidewinders that are competitive and reliable is because they happen to be on the transom of a boat that came from a trailer that is owned by a family that TESTS TESTS TESTS! Last season, we swapped out a supposed "dud" 15 SW and ran very well with it for the remainder of the year, I believe that motor even placed at the Nationals. Point is, don't point straight at the motor when it doesn't win, there are alot of other variables to the formula of success. For the record, I missed only one heat last year for a bad fuel pump - NOT Sidewinder produced, it was an OMC and who hasn't had one take a crap on them? Don't knock the motor, knock the whole package.

[Graham 18ce]

Raced my A SW all season and never missed a heat. even got it running pretty quick after lots of prop searching. haven't even touched the carb or timing.
I think they (Racing Outboards) offered a product that was just what they said for A anyway.
Was looking forward to getting a 15 (B), however, with all this talk of getting rid of them or combining with 20SSH and such, no thanks.