Setting the record straight

[YankeeRacing]

I was hurt at an APBA race and due to the insurance, my and APBA insurance, my hospital bill went down from $30,000+ to $6,000+ because the insurance companies negotiated with the hospital. What would happen to a racer who was not personally insured and did not have the AOF insurance to cover them? Without insurance I would have went bankrupt.

Thus, Mr. Black and AOF must answer Howie's question on this site.

Doug, 50-F.

Doug, it is not my place, but since no one else is answering, I believe I can help you with your questions since I helped write the policy.
Please, please do not compare AOF racing liability policy with what APBA has. AOF has NO meidical insurance what so ever except for the Hospital Trust Fund (HTF) that you can get a copy of by asking your Executive Director. From the HTF a person, if hurt or (heaven forbit), dies, can collect UP TO $2000 AFTER any other insurance is paid. In onther words, AOF HTF is secondary. Then there is also a deductable, I think, wihtout having it handy, is $500. maybe $250. The MOST anyone can ever collect for medical is $2000.
The AOF insurance policy covers AOF only from being sued. If you are a proven member, and AOF follows the rules per safety according to them (yellow tape at races, etc), then you are safe racing AOF by virtue of the incorporation.
I spent many a day in a courtroom listening in on Liabilty cases over my years as Executive Director.(The Executive Director is the one who could be sued individually because he/she is an employee and not part of the corporation). Right now, as it stands, the AOF membership application is not up to date and par. I have offered to help Rick bringit up to date and have given him the basics to do that for the safety of all who participate.
But just remember, the reason AOF can offer $200 per week end insurance is BECAUSE there is no medical..
Connie

[Mrs blueskyracer]

Connie - I thought that is was liability only and basically only covers damage done to the venue the race is being held at is that correct, or I suppose spectators who don't follow the safety guidelines - Teresa

[Mrs blueskyracer]

And, I guess I meant true spectators, not racing family members who should be familiar with all of the safety rules, have signed a release and obtained a bracelet.

[mercguy]

uh Teresa.........

Daren, I know you have me beat!

can I get that in writing???????

[YankeeRacing]

Teresa, You are correct. What did I say? Not sure, am working so mind is a little rattled.
The AOF policy is for specators only. And only if they are follwoing the rules that are posted, being sent out over P A, etc.
A racer can collect from HTF for medical, but that is not part of the AOF insurance policy. $25 of your membership is to be put into the HTF. It is a trust. You would have to petition to get it. But Doug, I think, was assuming that if he had the same accident at an AOF race that some of his medical would be covered. No, only up to $2000 and ths is only if his own insurance did not pay.
I made my daughter Angie quit racing when she was in dental school as it was just to much of a gamble as she did not have her own insurance..
If a boat racer hit a dock, or a pick upr boat, then no one is covered. I know for those of you who think it is the same this might be a shock. But, it is something that everyone needs to know going into an AOF race and membeship. Nothing hidden.
Dudley Malone said once, "It gets boats on the water." And he is right, a venue that wants a race, but wants the specators covered, it is a good deal. If a club wants more, then this is not the policy. If a racer wants more, then he/she needs to have their own policy. A racer also needs to double check their own policy to see if the usual are excluded: airplane pilots, white water rafting and racing of any kind.
Another hard lesson Steve Dunn, SC learned is that his policy only covered accidents of the racing sort IF he as admited to the hospital. He thought, like the rest of us, that he had good insurance. Guess he did if he was admitted. Fortunately for hm (race in Omaha), he was let go that same day. Unfortunately for his pocketbook he was not admitted.
For race sites that SLORA race at this is the perfect policy, no spectators anyway. Lake Placid is another venue that this is good for. Pineville is good in the fact that most of the specators are up on top of the pavilion and safe also.
Hope that helps.

[mercguy]

whoa!

Teresa, You are correct. What did I say? Not sure, am working so mind is a little rattled.
The AOF policy is for specators only. And only if they are follwoing the rules that are posted, being sent out over P A, etc.
A racer can collect from HTF for medical, but that is not part of the AOF insurance policy. $25 of your membership is to be put into the HTF. It is a trust. You would have to petition to get it. But Doug, I think, was assuming that if he had the same accident at an AOF race that some of his medical would be covered. No, only up to $2000 and ths is only if his own insurance did not pay.
I made my daughter Angie quit racing when she was in dental school as it was just to much of a gamble as she did not have her own insurance..
If a boat racer hit a dock, or a pick upr boat, then no one is covered. I know for those of you who think it is the same this might be a shock. But, it is something that everyone needs to know going into an AOF race and membeship. Nothing hidden.
Dudley Malone said once, "It gets boats on the water." And he is right, a venue that wants a race, but wants the specators covered, it is a good deal. If a club wants more, then this is not the policy. If a racer wants more, then he/she needs to have their own policy. A racer also needs to double check their own policy to see if the usual are excluded: airplane pilots, white water rafting and racing of any kind.
Another hard lesson Steve Dunn, SC learned is that his policy only covered accidents of the racing sort IF he as admited to the hospital. He thought, like the rest of us, that he had good insurance. Guess he did if he was admitted. Fortunately for hm (race in Omaha), he was let go that same day. Unfortunately for his pocketbook he was not admitted.
For race sites that SLORA race at this is the perfect policy, no spectators anyway. Lake Placid is another venue that this is good for. Pineville is good in the fact that most of the specators are up on top of the pavilion and safe also.
Hope that helps.

Connie says "For race sites that SLORA race at this is the perfect policy, no spectators anyway"

...........that was rude!!!!!! Moses Lake (a SLORA and also an SOA race) ALWAYS has LOTS of spectators!

[YankeeRacing]

Sorry Darren, You are right, I was rude. I had in mind sites like Elk River. I have been shown pictures of that site, maybe Waittes Lake, also? Rod sent me a pic once of a beautiful scenery with a Moose in the background and an eagle swooping down to get a fish.-while the races were going on. It was an awesome picture and an awesome race site. Of course, I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I thought it was nice and Rod told me there were no specators there execpt for Moose, but I guess not everyone would think that was so cool. I have been to Moses Lake several times, and yes, it would not be the site I was talking about. Nice site though. i am really sorry for offending you. I bet the mosse didn't mind though. I will see if I can find that picture.
Connie

[Mrs blueskyracer]

Connie that wasnt fair; a lot of spectators at SLORA races at Elk River, Newport, Ione, Waitts Lake and Moses Lake. Not so many at Banks Lake.

You didn't say anything wrong regarding insurance. I was just trying to confirm Liability Policy to protect the venue not individual racers and their equipment in 10 words or less.

There are some policies available out there to cover race teams, their equipment, etc. if people are interested. They aren't cheap but you can taylor them to your individual teams.

[Mrs blueskyracer]

In Writing!

Daren,

I hereby concede that in a pi**ing contest you would have me beat.

Unless of course we went for frequency (although you might beat me if it was o'beer thirty).

Teresa

[mercguy]

Sorry Darren, You are right, I was rude. I had in mind sites like Elk River. I have been shown pictures of that site, maybe Waittes Lake, also? Rod sent me a pic once of a beautiful scenery with a Moose in the background and an eagle swooping down to get a fish.-while the races were going on. It was an awesome picture and an awesome race site. Of course, I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I thought it was nice and Rod told me there were no specators there execpt for Moose, but I guess not everyone would think that was so cool. I have been to Moses Lake several times, and yes, it would not be the site I was talking about. Nice site though. i am really sorry for offending you. I bet the mosse didn't mind though. I will see if I can find that picture.
Connie

no offense takin Connie! Moses is a great venue (excellant park and facilities) and great place for spectator viewing!! Everyone just needs to quit throwing stones at one another and taking jabs...............

everyone have a great turkey day.......I'm outta here (and this conversation)!!!!!!!!!!

PS: my AOF/SLORA experience at Moses Lake!

[Mrs blueskyracer]

Connie, Thanks for apology! Actually there are a lot of spectators at Elk River (not counting moose and osprey) Many folks ride on their ATV's park and watch. Some spread blankets you can only watch from one side so when looking at boats on the course (which is small) you see trees, mountains and moose.

I don't know if I have any pictures but I will look. I don't usually take crowd shots only boats I am trying to do better however. Any pictures I have are what fits in a frame and not necessarily representative of the entire gallery so might be misunderstood.

Personally I would prefer to share with Moose, Osprey and Eagles over water moccasins, cotton mouths and alligators! I simply don't do reptiles, especially ones that might eat or kill me. {{{{{shuddering}}}}}

[YankeeRacing]

Darn it, you just ruined my image of Elk River. I thought it was out in the middle of no where with no one but boat races and Moose. I thought it was a secret spot and on my most favorite list. dang. Guess there are people everywhere.
And believe me I wasn't taking jabs. That came out all wrong. When you fill out the insurance application you have to list the amount of spectators you think you might have. Same as in APBA. I was always told that for that site no one but the moose. I could only dream of racing there.
I do know that Carls spot at Lake Apthorpe has some specators, but he is specifically not asking for a lot of them. Makes life a lot easier as far as insurance goes. Places like Moses Lake, DePue, Omaha, Orlando, etc, that aOF raced usually required more than one policy, sometimes a bond because of spectators.
Anyway, this was all about medical and AOF has none, and that is not a jab. It is what Doug needed to know.
Connie

[YankeeRacing]

Since I have a lot of time on my hands today (am working and waiting for some information): and since Darrens post, it occured to me that a lot of people don't know what AOF is really about.
AOF is not APBA.
AOF is grass roots racing.
If you have a lot of spectators (which usually means that you have sponsors), then the basic AOF policy and racing are not what you want. Your club would work with the Executive Director (Business Manager) to find an alternative, or add to the AOF policy.
Back a few years ago AOF got all Haughty Taughty and forgot our place. Some of us actually thought we were going to take over the boat racing world. Silly us. Not on this insurance policy. Once we realized we were the best number 2 a lot of doors opened. Like co-sanctioning. That is where an AOF race is sanctioned APBA. (AOF works as the APBA club). Sure, everyone who races has to join APBA, but in the long run (cost of extra insurances to cover the medical, sponsors, etc) it is usually less expensive in the long run. The cost of APBA membership can usually be subsidized by the sponsor, etc.
Now going back to when a basic AOF race is the answer is when a club wants to put a race site in a secluded area or one that is just plain for fun, , at a site that is building, or at a site that is dying, or at a site that is perfect, but the club just prefers to put more money in the kitty.

I also wanted to comment on my idea for double or co officers. AOF is governed by the Racing Commission. The officers are only a small part of the racing commission. Right now the issue seems to be who are the Racing Commission membes. If this cannot be worked out then it goes to a court in Oklahoma, state of incorporation for them to decide. Whomever loses pays, and AOF money could not be used to defend this at this point. It just seems to me that with the shoddy bookkeeping and record keeping the last four years that the winner would be the Lifetime members. Just my opinion. I sure hate to see if go to court for a sport that is supposed to be fun. Seems to me that it could be worked out if all tried. Since neither side wants to give, then why in the heck can't we just have double officers? How is more going to hurt? More good opinions are better than no opinions, and if there is a problem, vote and see how it goes.
Just my opinion.

[Kev43V]

Personally I would prefer to share with Moose, Osprey and Eagles over water moccasins, cotton mouths and alligators! I simply don't do reptiles, especially ones that might eat or kill me. {{{{{shuddering}}}}}[/QUOTE]

ROLMBO Bluesky
It is really all relative to what you are used too. many people probably feel the same way about them bears you got up there.

Oh for the record i would rather take my chances with a bear than a gator too

[Jack Stotts]

On the subject of critters, two years ago at a late season race at Pineville, all morning long as the racers were setting up and a few children were playing in the shallow water an approximate 6 foot gator was basking about 25 yards off the beach. Just watching us. Well, I was in the first heat and when the motors started the gator dove but we had no idea where he went. On the last lap in the second turn my breaker point cam split and I had a sudden loss of power and rudder authority. The boat spun and I flew out landing, what I thought, was tooooo close to the gators basking point. I had no trouble climbing into the rescue boat.

I always tell Northerners that we, in Texas, have never had someone come back and say they were attacked by an alligator. Think on that for a minute.