Region 5 Class Structure Thoughts??

[scorer]

Costs

If you have to pay for the Ambulance, divers and PA system, you can eat up 5K really quick. Divers and Ambulance at DePue, Ill race (not nationals) cost $3945. for a 3 day race.

[Jose Jr. 21]

At Frostproof last year I time from the last heat before sst45, untill the first heat after, they had the whole lake for 50 minutes. for two heats of racing this is crazy.


That is totally ridiculous. You must of been counting from the time we started launching, to the time we finished, which was a good 3 or 4 heats before we were even suppose to run. Lets not even talk about how long it takes a heat going, and thats for every class!! Maybe if there was not so much finger pointing at certain classes, clubs, etc., and majority of us racers would try to get together and not have 100 clubs in the same area, it might actually be "possible" to have enough help, and intelligence to put on some well organized decent local events in this region.

[F-111]

Bottom line is the fighting, *****ing, and finger pointing is just ridiculous down here. Too many different agendas. Somebody comes up with an idea that might be a little radical or different (dare i say liberal!), and then it just starts more *****ing (Oh that will never work! blah blah blah) before said idea has a chance to get off the ground. Then well meaning individuals who bust their a$$ in order to get something going get burned out and say screw it, and i can't say i blame them.
Then you got the same old tired excuses that have been beaten into the ground on this site, mainly about too many classes, too long a day, and your class getting cut down to one heat. Yes we've all experienced that and it sucks nobody likes it, yet we still don't see anything changing as far as that goes. Howie's idea may or may not work, but give it a shot. What do you got to lose at this point?!
Increasing entry fees- good luck with that one! we're spread thin numbers wise as it is, so you're going to tell the few folks who do keep supporting the locals that they have to pay more, especially those who run 3-4-5 classes not to mention step ups and fill ins!
Here's another one that has been brought up, if the insurance and sanction fees are so high why don't you run AOF race instead? Been there, done that, nobody shows up.

So, what now?
Less *****in, more action!

Just my 2 cents,
Jon Eldredge

[PopPop]

Unless you guys start working together, your region could be in a death spiral. You'll lose workers, and racers. Then you'll have fewer people paying higher fees, etc., etc.b Why is it that we all seem to agree that we have too many classes and yet we continue to run the 3-4 boat classes. Long days, one heat. It ain't getting any better.

[DougMc]

OK Let's try this, who is in favor of these classes and these only running at the Region 5 races???

OPC

SST120
SST60
SST45

SLT X-Class

J Hydro

ASH
ASR
CSH
CSR

125cc Hydro
250cc Hydro

These are the classes that have numbers in them, not 1 real boat in the class then 3-4 step ups. Speak up let us know!!! It is not to late to make it happen for this year, new members will now what equipment to buy if they want to race in Florida...

This is very close to what we have now in the stock division. With the stockers it wouldn't be a radical move. One difference is that OSY is now stronger than CSH. This may change as the younger guys get older and become of CSH age. Such a stock structure gives home to the yamatos and new Sidewinder A. If the Sidewinder Bs were bought up and grew they could run with the CSH until they had enough to field their own BSH. I would just make sure that the BSH's (Yamato 80s and Sidewinders) could run with us CSH if they showed until, or if, they got a strong class. I would want to make sure Ron Selewach's new motors had a home since he is here in Florida.

[HRTV]

In Europe they run OSY400 thats it! I wonder why here in the states we feel compelled to run every class from the last ten years because we are afraid someone might not get a chance to race. If I said it once I have said it a million times 3 boats in a class is not racing its just a waste of time face it. I live in region 4 and I can remember back to the good old days when this region was a hot bed for both Stock Outboard and OPC racing, OPC races could be found all over the region from Southern Maryland and all points in between boats lined up across the beaches of Southern Maryland and Virginia as far as the eye could see. Back in those days I personally belong to a club called the Speed Masters Racing based out of Washington, DC which was an African American racing club made up of over ten members, yes minorities were heavily involved in boat racing for those of you not familiar with the history of boat racing in region 4 such names like Rudy Foote and Kenny Curtis just to name a few of legendary African American OPC racers to come out of region 4.

As the years went by the ugly politics slowly started to move into the sport of racing which quickly prompted racers and races to fade away and before you could blink an eye OPC racing had completely gone from the region all together by the mid 90's the region was a ghost town no races all gone!

It was in the mid 90's that I became interested in Stock Outboard Racing in region 4 and boy let me tell you the races were every where just about every weekend just like in OPC the boats would line up on the beaches of Maryland, VA and North Carolina as far as the eye could see. I have a photo from Denton Maryland back in the early 90's and there must be over 200 boats at Denton Maryland! yes thats right Denton! the region was on fire and was a hot bed for Stock Outboard racing.

Then came the late 90's and early 2000 and the races started to dry up all the races we once had were gone! I might be wrong but so far for 2007 region 4 has one race on the books scheduled for Wilson, NC.

Wake up region 5 !!!!!

[Dave M]

Does Anyone Notice

A recouring theme that seems to be present a lot more often than it should ?

As the years went by the ugly politics slowly started to move into the sport of racing which quickly prompted racers and races to fade away and before you could blink an eye OPC racing had completely gone from the region all together by the mid 90's the region was a ghost town no races all gone!
!!!!!

I think the ugly politics are responsible for the decline of boat racing in general.

And costs....... that much for divers and amblulances ?? That is high. I have been to a lot of races that the ambulance company is there, but at no cost, maybe they are a sponsor ? Divers... there are enough racers who dive, or have family and friends that dive, starting calling in some favors, get them interested. I would think most divers would jump at the chance to do something like this for free. I would start looking in the not so obvious places to save costs. Buy the divers supper and maybe hotel for a night and I bet they would be happy.

Maybe I am way off base, I just never seen that high a cost to put a race on. The last race I put on was in Coldwater, MI. It was an APBA race a while ago and it cost nearly 3K. That included everything. The majority of the cost was insurance. I can't believe it has more than doubled in less than 10 years. If it has, that is sad.

[AOFoffice]

Suggestion

The AOF rulebook says that those who need divers will pay for them. (this is not always the case, because sometimes a club will voluntarily agree to do this).

But if cost is an issue, and there are only a few classes needing divers, then let their entry fees reflect that. Keep the small kneeldowns with cheaper entry fees. Set aside a time for the classes needing divers, maybe on Saturday before the rest of the racing begins. Run both days. If the divers have to be paid by the hour, then send them home. A cost effective method for eveyone with the club getting entry fees from everyone as usual, just a change in the program.

[Matt Dagostino]

National Issue....................

One of the appealing aspects of APBA Stock Outboard Racing is that you have a "NATIONAL" uniformity of classes and a member should feel secure that his/her class will be scheduled to run at any APBA Stock Outboard event in the country given enough of them show up at the event to make a class. The Stock Commission has never taken a stand that member clubs 'must' schedule 'all stock classes' at their races which i never understood. We have X number of national classes that our leaders seem comfortable with so consequently member APBA Stock Outboard clubs should have to schedule them all and 'COMBINE" or cancel them race day if their are not enough enteries. Most of us run multiple classes so for member APBA clubs to try and cherry pick classes at certain events will never help grow the Stock membership.

Howie, my thought would be advertise 'all stock classes' and combine classes with less than say 5 boats if that is a comfortable number. If I was the Stock Outboard Chair i would find it disturbing that member clubs would pick and choose what classes they want to run. While we all know certain classes are stronger in certain regions, the door should be open for our 'entire' stock outboard menu to be run since we perport to be a national cataglory.

We all know the reality would be that the same classes would show week after week but at least the national structure would be intact and the opportunity their for all classes to participate.

[Steve Warnock]

National Issue

Matt,

GEE's we agree on something!

WOW!

Howie,

This is what we do in the midwest. We offer All Stock and Mod classes and at some races we can barely muster 65 -75 entries. Best to offer the whole plate and see who shows up. The next year you can plan better.

Warbs

[Corin_Huke]

In Europe they run OSY400 thats it! I wonder why here in the states we feel compelled to run every class from the last ten years because we are afraid someone might not get a chance to race.

Hey Dan, OSY is just the tip of the iceberg in terms of classes we run in Europe!

In the hydro classes we run (pro) 0-125, 0-250, 0-350, 0-500, 0-700, plus OSY and the OSY-R class which they are trying to get off the ground. OSY-R is the standard Yamato engine (usually 302) with a restrictor plate between the back of the carb and the reed block. They are trying to get this class introduced as a starter for other pro and stock classes

In addition to the above we also have the classic hydro class which is growing in strength year by year

What I think you were trying to say is that we only race the UIM classes and that our racing strictly falls into two categories, stock and modified (ie full blown pro racing). We don't have any classes which could be considered half way between stock and pro

Our stock classes, other than the rules relating to what constitutes a hydro and the corresponding safety rules, weight rules, do not have any restrictions as to running heights, etc. You can do whatever you think is best/quickest for you. The engines are straight out of the box with no mods allowed whatsoever

The pro classes are, as I understand it, the same as in the US. Make whatever engine mods you wish as long as you do not exceed the class cc limit

Obviously there are other rules for the different classes - OSY running on gas and pro on methanol, but that's pretty much the class set up in Europe in a nutshell

As I said in my opening comment, I'm sure that you didn't think we only ran OSY400 in Europe, but if you did, shame on you!!!!

[HRTV]

Hey Dan, OSY is just the tip of the iceberg in terms of classes we run in Europe!

In the hydro classes we run (pro) 0-125, 0-250, 0-350, 0-500, 0-700, plus OSY and the OSY-R class which they are trying to get off the ground. OSY-R is the standard Yamato engine (usually 302) with a restrictor plate between the back of the carb and the reed block. They are trying to get this class introduced as a starter for other pro and stock classes

In addition to the above we also have the classic hydro class which is growing in strength year by year

What I think you were trying to say is that we only race the UIM classes and that our racing strictly falls into two categories, stock and modified (ie full blown pro racing). We don't have any classes which could be considered half way between stock and pro

Our stock classes, other than the rules relating to what constitutes a hydro and the corresponding safety rules, weight rules, do not have any restrictions as to running heights, etc. You can do whatever you think is best/quickest for you. The engines are straight out of the box with no mods allowed whatsoever

The pro classes are, as I understand it, the same as in the US. Make whatever engine mods you wish as long as you do not exceed the class cc limit

Obviously there are other rules for the different classes - OSY running on gas and pro on methanol, but that's pretty much the class set up in Europe in a nutshell

As I said in my opening comment, I'm sure that you didn't think we only ran OSY400 in Europe, but if you did, shame on you!!!!

Hey Corin,

Thanks for clearing that up I knew better but your clarification is correct and what I was trying to say.

[joelbrown]

with just these these classes the lighter kids like myself cannot run any classes i just purchased a 20/osy rig and if u just run the classes your talking about i will not be able to run.

[NUT2F]

with just these these classes the lighter kids like myself cannot run any classes i just purchased a 20/osy rig and if u just run the classes your talking about i will not be able to run.

Joel,
Don't worry we(Peace River) will not go to this kind of class structure. We will schedule all classes and combine to fill classes, NO ONE SHOULD BE LEFT OUT!

[PopPop]

In Europe, they do not have J, AX, A, B, 20, C and D in both hydro and runabout to contend with. With those, the Mod equivilent along with Formula classes, Pro runabouts, and "sorta OPC" (Sport C and 44ss) we have classes for everyone from your kids to your grandmother. Even those who still think they are kids have classes and we try to cater to them all. I don't have enough fingers and toes to count them all. No matter what we do, we always wind up running about 5 heats/hour and no one can do the math. So we run the last of Saturdays races on Sunday and do that by running one-heat racing. There is no way the Europeans can imagine dealing with this nonsencical gaggle. We try to make everyone happy and wind up making no one happy. Spectators can't figure out what the heck is going on and we are hardly doing anything to make it more attractive to new members.
I have no answers, just observations.