20 SSH

[csh-2z]

One other thing to take into consideration and this is very important. The B class weights are in the 365# range. Unless you have an ultra light (very expensive) boat a driver can't be over 175# or so and remain competitive weightwise. In the 25SSR & 20SSH classes a 200+# driver still has a viable option rather than being limited to C or D.

[Fastjack]

When did silly season move to June ?

[pav225]

No worries Val,
You, me, and Mikey can run our 80s at Hinton :-)

[csh-2z]

There are no plans to remove the Sidewinder from 20SSH and it remains a co-motor of choice with the 300 series Yamato's. Currently, the "motor of choice" concept is the closest we have been able to get to a concrete plan for the future. As a member based organization that elects it's representatives annually, change or evolution flows with the speed of a glacier.

[Val16E]

For the hundredth time. The Sidewinder is in 20SSH and 25SSR because they are the only two classes that are run NATIONALLY ( in most Regions) that the motor fits in based on cu. in. Without the exposure in these classes, we will lose a manufacturer. How many regions are the B classes or 25SSH normally run in? Are any of you suggesting that we can grow these classes out of nothing in most Regions? I hope not because that would be insane. We need to be in 20SSH & 25SSR to showcase these motors everywhere in an effort save the B classes from extinction & to help this manufacturer succeed for our future benefit. How would the SORC expect a manufacturer to succeed with no nationally run classes. Would it be worth losing the only American outboard manufacturer besides Mercury, so you can continue to win with your Yamato 80 that hasn't been manufactured in 38 years? And by the way, what difference does it make that the guys beating you have a Yamato 302 or 321 or a Sidewinder? Is this a perfect set up? No. But neither are any of the other multi-motor classes. As things are right now, your best chance of winning 20SSH is with a 302 or 321 and yet all the complaints are about the Sidewinder.

As a member and someone who is looking to buy new motors as the sport evolves...I want to get a clear understanding. When are we intending to remove the sidewinder from the 20ssh class? I think a solid guess or plan would be helpful as it will affect purchases. Please advise.

[sponsonhead]

And that, sports fans, is how you drop the mic.

[csh-2z]

For the hundredth time. The Sidewinder is in 20SSH and 25SSR because they are the only two classes that are run NATIONALLY ( in most Regions) that the motor fits in based on cu. in. Without the exposure in these classes, we will lose a manufacturer. How many regions are the B classes or 25SSH normally run in? Are any of you suggesting that we can grow these classes out of nothing in most Regions? I hope not because that would be insane. We need to be in 20SSH & 25SSR to showcase these motors everywhere in an effort save the B classes from extinction & to help this manufacturer succeed for our future benefit. How would the SORC expect a manufacturer to succeed with no nationally run classes. Would it be worth losing the only American outboard manufacturer besides Mercury, so you can continue to win with your Yamato 80 that hasn't been manufactured in 38 years? And by the way, what difference does it make that the guys beating you have a Yamato 302 or 321 or a Sidewinder? Is this a perfect set up? No. But neither are any of the other multi-motor classes. As things are right now, your best chance of winning 20SSH is with a 302 or 321 and yet all the complaints are about the Sidewinder.

[tim king]

The one thing that I'm leaving out is that there are no average drivers running these motors. It may very will be that you put a average driver in the boat and they won't do so well. Both of the boats I see running the SW ether of them are going to run out front in any boat.

PS I do run CSH

[Matt Dagostino]

I hear you Howie and was at the meeting when that rationale was provided to help justify the compromise solution. A compromise solution is a lose lose outcome. This is the slow death pathway. Whatever the solution, make a decision for one engine and move forward.

Howie........what is the 'end game' of the 20ci Sidewinder in 20ssh as a voting Commissioner?. Is it a temporary playground in 20ssh to gain traction and move onto it's own class or maybe rejuvinate 25ssh? As far as i know there is no FACTORY position on this matter? Do you know something we don't?

You asked for solutions in lieu of 'whining' in a previous post. Ok, here is a solution:

1. Remove the sidewinder 20ci from the Yamato 20ssh class and put it in 25ssh as been hinted at by those in the Sidewinder 'loop' effective November 1, 2016.

2. Suggest to those 'heavy' people that want to run in 20ssh to run CSH or several other Stock Outboard classes that can accomadate a 'heavy' person.
FYI....not sure what constitutes a heavy person? I will have to consult with Gary Pond and get back to ya'll.

[tim king]

I didn't start this thread because it was any disadvantage to me. I don't even run 20s I'm 40 pounds over weight. I have ran it in the past and it just takes me a lot longer to get to speed. I just think for the average guy who has spent a lot of time and effort in the class.To have someone bye one of these motors and put it on the very first boat that they get. And get a prop from who ever. Any prop maker knows what prop will work with these motors. To be able to even run up front is discouraging for that person. It's kinda like buying your way in. By just adding more weight to the boat would put them back running with the average guy. They haven't even really got them dialed in yet. I think they are on the first boat still. Maybe I'm way out of place however isn't this what forums are for?

[PittmanRacing]

I hear you Howie and was at the meeting when that rationale was provided to help justify the compromise solution. A compromise solution is a lose lose outcome. This is the slow death pathway. Whatever the solution, make a decision for one engine and move forward.

[Howie Nichols]

Matt,
It has been explained the reason for 2 motors of choice. In Chicago this topic was beat around for a while. Like it or not it was thought the SW could be the motor for the heavier driver and the Yamato could be the motor for the lighter driver, no other reason just that.

So what are the solutions here for the class? Put it out there and see where it goes, perhaps something good will come out so you the members can give the SORC the direction to look at.

[stockc]

Dear SORC,

In your view, has a parity decision ever been made in which all affected parties impacted felt the playing field was rendered completely equal?

I speculate not. Regardless, why did the SORC willfully interject this monkey wrench into what is being professed as perhaps the strongest stock outboard class in the APBA? Clearly participation in 20ssh is strongly standing on its own merits. The likely fall out of this meddling is a lot of wasted time, expense and certainly a component of participant dissatisfaction.

For the record, my views are in no way influenced from having the opportunity to get beat by Kyle Bahl at times this year(-: Secondly, to fend off any civics lectures I voted NO.

Ken McMurphy

[Charlie Pater]

I like the direction of this conversation. It would be nice if the Sidewinder people would actually promote the B classes for new Sidewinder motors. Maybe offering new motors as prizes for winning the nationals in B hydro and B runabout with new Sidewinders like the Yamato people did some time ago. Or significant cash prizes for winning with newly purchased Sidewinders.. They could also lobby for the Sidewinders to be the motor of choice in 25 ssh. Actually, there are probably many other ideas for promoting the Sidewinders. The key is to promote the product. Seams to me riding on the coattails of the Yamatos is not really promoting their products.

[Matt Dagostino]

Well said Paul.........the SORC a few years ago made a commitment to designate a MOTOR OF CHOICE in every class to remove the uncertainty you refer to. Recently they named the Sidewinder a co-motor of choice in 20ssh with the Yamato. Not sure what's up with that. The goal of 'one motor-one class' is a good one to remove uncertainty and provide a clear path. This current decision is puzzling to make 2 motors of choice in the second biggest class in APBA.