New Race Season Format?...

[MGallagher]

Was thinking about some of the low turnout races and the price of gasoline and other factors that seem to be hurting our sport. I know its been talked about before, but I would like to start a conversation about a topic I've thought about a lot.
1- Changing the high points system.(stock and mod)

• first 10 races plus a divisional championship and a national championship
• giving each division a certain number of races per year (ie: 5 NE Races; 5 SE Races; 5 Mid-west Races; 5 western races) or base it upon population of racers in each division
• 20 race weekends plus championship events
• And regardless of weather conditions throughout the country there must be an off season of 2 months in December and January

This type of set up would promote much larger turnouts and more racers traveling to different divisions to compete since there will be less races in there division to earn points.

Just a thought!

Any takers!

[MGallagher]

Nobody wants to touch this one I'm guessing!

Is it really that bad of an idea?

[Cameraboy]

thinkin's good...

Not to answer a questions with questions, but how many races is too many, and far to drive is too far? Which is a bigger advantage, an area (might be one region, might be several) with a lot of racers, or an area near a lot of races? Is location an issue (ie. middle of nowhere in the desert vs the coast vs near a city)? What percentage of members actually chase national points? OK, I'm tired now.

[jeff55v]

My 2 cents...

Matt, Just speaking for myself. I do not "chase points". I go to races that are close to home. Points mean nothing to me.
But that's just me.

[MGallagher]

Mike:Q1-current format is 8 races, above format is 7 races. Q2-I guess a far drive depends on where you are in the country(anything above 10 hrs.?). Q3-It is a division approach not a region approach, and maybe after APBA gives you your 5 per division then the clubs in that division get together and decide who gets what race and where to do it based upon things like pit conditions, location of race, type of course, exposure to spectator crowds, etc...Q4-See previous answer.Q5-25-40%? Not many do and believe me I understand that. This is more of an attempt to have more racers attend less races instead of a small amount of racers at a lot of races.Also, If you have certain racers coming to your race because they want the points, I notice that some people will attend that race because they want to compete against that racer either to compare there equipment to said racer or just compete with a good racer. Certain names bring people to a race sometimes. This format would promote that.

Jeff- I understand your point of view, I only chase points when I'm winning LOL. However, I do like to compete against myself each year. Not many people do go for points but as for the people who do it is a very strategic game and they usually bring a crowd if people know if they are coming to there race for points.

Thanks Guys, I know this is a Pandora's Box type topic, but I would like to chip away at some potential solutions to low turnout races.

Sometimes less (races) is more(turnout)!

[rbengines]

Me Also

Matt, Just speaking for myself. I do not "chase points". I go to races that are close to home. Points mean nothing to me.
But that's just me.

Points are for the fortune person who has enough money and time to travel to the most races. I put a higher mark for the person that wins the Nationals.

[kws]

i think our focus should be on getting MORE LOCAL races put together as apposed to less races.( I am looking at this from the perspective of how to get NEW people interested.) if newbies could race 4 or 5 times in a summer and not drive 40 or 50 hours to get their 30 minutes of boat time. then stock and mod racing would be much more tempting to the prospective new racer.
just my 2 cents

[Andrew 4CE]

This is my view too...

i think our focus should be on getting MORE LOCAL races put together as apposed to less races.( I am looking at this from the perspective of how to get NEW people interested.) if newbies could race 4 or 5 times in a summer and not drive 40 or 50 hours to get their 30 minutes of boat time. then stock and mod racing would be much more tempting to the prospective new racer.
just my 2 cents

[CSR4C]

i think our focus should be on getting MORE LOCAL races put together as apposed to less races.( I am looking at this from the perspective of how to get NEW people interested.) if newbies could race 4 or 5 times in a summer and not drive 40 or 50 hours to get their 30 minutes of boat time. then stock and mod racing would be much more tempting to the prospective new racer.
just my 2 cents

More local races is what is needed. In Region 11 we try to have at least 8 weekends of racing each year. This year we are down to 7 plus a kilos. Also no back to back weekends of racing. Since we run 6 catergories (J, SO, MO, PRO, OPC & Cracker Box) National championship time puts a big hole in our season, so it is split with no races between mid July and Labor Day. I live at the south end of our region and my longest travel is 200 miles to Oroville. Stockton has more racers than anywhere in the region, their travel is only 100 miles or less to any of our races. We have 2 good testing locations, Copperopolis and Oroville. Our entry fees may be a bit higher than back east, but less of our money is going to the oil companys.
To attract new racers we have our Nor Cal 400 rental program. In Region 10 the H.A.R.M. J Hydro progran has been a big boost for Js in their region. Ihe inboarders in region 4 are working on a JH project with 5 boats. The outboarders in that area should be giving them a hand to get their project on the water.
High points, our goal should be participation at races, not limited races for high points.

Darrell 4-C

[Matt Dagostino]

Points............................

I agree with the couple of posts about not chasing points. Revamping the point system means very little in terms of deciding on what races to attend.

My number one criteria is the quality of the body of water and the race course. For example last weekend at Curwensville due to the limited milling area and the shallow lake the water was very marginal to race on and would give me pause as weather to go back again. Imagine if we had a class with 12 boats there running on those rollers. Whereas a site like Millville or Grass Lake, MI are 'good' lake courses that are generally consistant water conditions.

The Sharptown thread is questioning why more people don't come. I have been there year after year since it is 2 hours from home but in terms of a race course it is in my opinion only adequate to hold 7-8 boats at best!! I will continue to support it as it is close and a club race but due to the nature of the body of water i suspect it will always be a poorly attended event.

I think even if a club gives a break on entry fees or even prize money the key is always the body of water and the course in my book.

[MGallagher]

This is exactly why I put this post on here. To get quality input on how to increase participation at various dying race sites. I have taken notice to the hard work the west has put into their racing program and wish to incorporate some of those ideas back east. I agree with all of you on many points. Keep up the good work gentlemen(used loosely) and thanks for the responses.

Just to keep the ball rolling, what about a mid-year mini-nationals?

[kws]

if people take the minni nationals seriously, then once again you have more dead time in the season do to people not wanting to risk their equipment too close to a mini nat, thereby reducing particapation at local races. more importantly NO ONE will want to try to sanction a race that close to a national event. In my mind there is no way less races will IMPROVE racing it will only HURT RACING. if less races were better, then the regions with fewer races would be the ones thriving. when you look around the country is that what you see?

[BP125V]

small races

Thanks for your concern and efforts on behalf of you club Matt. When we have a race site that has a body of water that is less than optimal we try to offset that with other things such as testing Friday and Saturday evening, a dinner Saturday evening, giving a break on entry fees if someone signs up for more than X classes, etc.

Nothing wrong with a course that only holds 7-8 boats at a time, if all of the classes had 8 boats you would have a decent weekend. Please don't fall into the trap of the SUPER RACE. That is a short term fix and guranteed long term disaster. The sport has survived as long as it has (with all of it's faults) because we have had clubs putting on local races. By going to less but "bigger" races you make people driver further and the odds of them missing races goes up. Plus like KWS said, how do you attract new members if they have to drive so far to a race?

What all clubs have to do is to convince those current members who skip club races of the value of having a decent showing at club races. A race is the best way to promote ourselves. People can see the boats in action and talk to us and touch and feel the boats. They can see all of the positives our sport has to offer for themselves. It is hard to convey all that with a video clip.

At club meetings or even here on HR.net, show income vs expenses. Illustrate how important it is for everyone in the area to show up. remind people that it is hard for a volunteer organization to put on a race if only a handful of people show up. Who is going man the turn boats or judge's stand.

I wish I had all the answers, but I can gurantee that series racing in lieu of club racing is NOT the answer.

Bill Pavlick

[kws]

Matt
I am sorry i was not trying to yell at you. i was only trying to add emphasis to key words. in the future i will use bold type
i don't have the answers to fixing Stock outboards problems either. I only have my opinions. please keep the idea's flowing

[kws]

with your mini nats idea- would you then push the nats to the end of the season?