Originally posted by pav225
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Chris,
Not to put you on the spot, but if 300ssR ever got rolling, I think we should consider having the same molded boat for everyone. You guys would be a great choice for that.
- Mike
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The 300ss class needs to be fixed now. It is supposed to be an equal performance class because it is sealed. This is a joke and the old time racers know it. Have you wondered why old time racing teams can still win when the motor is sealed and the props are all the same? Well, the mag, the head, the foot, and the carb are not sealed! Each can contribute to a speed advantage within the current specs and the SORC needs to fix this. Very tight specs are needed with go no go testers or the class will continue to not live up to its goals and the fast guys will keep winning.
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As the motors come from Japan they are EQUAL! The racing commission there knows what they are doing and those motors are equal. When sealed they are equal. But our specs allow parts to be modified, that is a big error and needs to be fixed. This class was intended to remain stock, ie equal.
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You nailed John! Funny the stadium racing in Japan uses identically prepared engines and people bet on the drivers. It’s a multibillion dollar business! The big question is why are we modifying these new reconditioned engines once they arrive here if they were all good enough for a multibillion dollar industry? I had suggested before to people close to the SW engine program that they go out and seek sponsorship to back the engine through the Unlimiteds and create a series like the Merc Challenge to promote their engine classes and promote stock outboard racing. New blood in boat racing comes from the grassroots level, think Aaron Salmon started in the J program, then CSH, now Unlimiteds. I think the SW is a better engine because of the tight CNC specs and the manufacturer controls all spec changes not the SORC, the engine is American made, it’s a good sell. It’s a few self serving people that aren’t looking at the big picture and doing what’s best for the whole. It’s always been that way.
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I know this is just talk and Brain storming different classes. But I have a few questions.
1st why would you wanna take entries away from CSH by adding a CSH lite class ? With Yamato engine availability being a complete nightmare why add classes that use that engine ?
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300SSR, I think a lot of people figured it would be like the old 80 runabout ride. Which I was told, was horrible.
300SSH has had some success (I say some because I do have concerns with 30SSH), we should consider getting more info from the guys who have tested 300 runabout and figure out if that is a class we should consider. But in doing that, 2 other things have to be address.
Engine availability being #1.
#2 being, what class do we get rid of before we add another class?"Ask anyone, I have no friends. I do have some people that put up with me and mostly because they like the rest of my family"
Don Allen
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Bob K brought up the issue of making financial ends meet. I get it...been a club Commodore/Race Director...I know the numbers that have to be achieved to put on a race and for a club to sustain financial health.
But there are solutions...and most importantly...what we have been doing for the past 20 years is not working and the ship continues to take on water very slowly.
First...the classes that keep hanging on by a thread aren't contributing much at all to the financial health of any club or the National organization. In many cases, they don't show up to races...and if so...contribute 6-8 entries over an entire weekend.
Worst of all...they are dragging us down. No one pushes a new driver into AMH, AMR, 25Mod H, DSR, etc.. We want new people to flock to classes that have a future...so they will stick around long term.
Now...say we have new drivers in sustainable classes...but they only get their 2 heats a day/no testing...waiting around for 6-8 hours to race because we've got 40+ heats to race because of ALL the classes that need to run. How appealing is that? Think about it from their perspective. Would you be chomping at the bit to sign up for a sport like that?
Hell, raise entry fee $5...offer some testing...and maybe a 3 heat format. Do SOMETHING to reverse the slow leak in the boat. The status quo isn't working....and the vast majority of the old timers even realize this...let alone the younger drivers.
I see a hell of a lot of $100k motor homes in the pits. I think a $5-10 entry increase is not asking too much if you get more water time.
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Spot on Dana! Running fewer CLASSES per day by the race committees and adding and extra heat per class and possibly some testing sure would be more appealing for an added 10 bucks a day.
I figure any out of town race within my region is about $500 a weekend. If I can get an extra heat per day plus testing for another 20 or 30 bucks a weekend? Hell yeah!
I typically run one class a day, so $500 for 4 heats a weekend is $125 per heat, and 6 heats would be less than $90 per heat and I get a few test laps for free! I just wanna play with my raceboat...
Add another $0.02...
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Originally posted by pav225 View Post300ssH has really taken off, why wouldn't 300ssR?When it comes to boat racing and the wife, it's easier to ask for forgiveness than it is permission, and of course I spent a number of nights sleeping on the couch!
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Originally posted by guedo499 View PostOutboard Category:
Remove 45 its an OPC class
Remove 20ssh see below
Remove 25ssr - redundant
Remove the 200ccH/R (the Hotrod Mod) local class
Remove 400cmH local class
Remove 175cch no one make s 175 motor, just 125s stepping up
Remove OSY 400 - redundant
Remove one antique class pick one, the one with the most cranks left
Remove k Pro match up age for ASH
Remove 700cch 1100 is plenty
Remove 500cch 1100 is plenty
Add CSH Lite (400 lbs with a restrictor)
Remove 750cmR (will run with 850s with no weight) same ETs
Hall can be base off what the inboard category does only AWESOME seasons get in, not just the top three, just because.
Cut the commissioners by 2/3rds.
Combine rule books.
Have fun.
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Not to be the one to be against the one size fits all ideas put forth here (didn't know the silly season started this early) but everything that is listed can be done already. There is no need to change the National Categories or Commissioners. All that is needed is a club to step up and put only those classes on the sanction and then tell the drivers that the entry fee will be determined based on the number of entries. You only want 6 classes and run 3 laps per heat, test from 10-12 then race from noon & done at 4- no problem. List it on the sanction and go do it. Do you want a 300SSR - come up with a set of rules and run it as a local class for local points.
What I am saying is if all these ideas are the next development in the Sport - convince your friends and your club to implement them. Cherry pick the best classes and only put those on a sanction. See who shows up and how the bills get paid. If it works, keep doing it.
Brian 10s
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I just think that the Commissions should be putting out a Buffet and the clubs should be able to take as much or as little as they want. And those same clubs should be able to "promote or push" whatever classes fit their area. The idea that if we kill off these 10 classes, that will make these other 10 that much bigger has never worked. If it was only that easy. If everyone wanted to run 20 & C, they all would already. Guess what, most Drivers do not want to run C & 20 and killing their class will just drive them away not convert them. Now if each Commission wanted to set certain levels of participation for High Points, Nationals and HOC, that is perfectly acceptable as well.
The reality is most clubs need every single entry they can get. We have tried just about everything: running 3 days over 2, 3 heats for the biggest classes, Friday testing and tow money - and there is not magic solution. Doesn't matter what you try, there are some will not like it. A free 3rd day race, 1/2 the entries signed up. 3rd heats for selected classes - give them to the J's, we don't want to run again today. Testing - don't want to hurt my motor. Tow Money - that's nice but . . .
Last edited by Brian10s; 08-01-2018, 12:15 PM.Brian 10s
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