RFID Timing

[racer3j]

We have all lost a nationals on time by tenths of seconds or swore we did not jump the gun, but yet when it comes down to it the officials make the decision (Not bashing out race officials). With all of the technology available, why are we still allowing human error to impact the outcome of a race? There was just a post made about what type of camera to use for officials to judge starts, which made me think, why don't we follow suit with all other forms of racing eliminate the camera and timers which allow for the human error, and transition to a RFID chip with a sensor at the starting line. I am sure I am missing something, but there are tons of timing devices out there that can be purchased for relatively cheap, and the RFID Chips cost barely anything ($.29 per chip). If a rule was in place that you must run an RFID in the front 3 inches of your boat, we could accurately time record runs, national events, and eliminate the possibility of throwing someone out who "has that color helmet, but we couldn't see the number". Many will argue costs, and ease of use, but with how far this technology has come in recent years a timing device can be purchased for around the same cost as a new iPad.
To play out the scenario, everyone enters their RFID number on their entry blank just like their APBA number. The scorer enters in the numbers in all classes. When the clock hits 0 the device is turned on, if your number does not appear you jumped the gun, it will then continue to time laps until the race is over. This will allow races to be run more efficiently, and eliminate those trips to the judges stand to "see the tape". If you are out you are out.
Here is a system that is known for its ease of use, and can even be rented. The only issue I see is distance, but I am sure that can be worked around with different systems.
http://orbiter.com/products/

Lets start to bring this sport into the future and use the technology that is at our disposal.
Like I said, I am sure I am missing something but just trying to get an idea, and see some feedback.

Dylan Runne

[Tim Weber]

Good idea but I think you need an active transmitting RFID unit. The active chip is powered by a small power source and sends out its' own signal.
One of the most used units I know of are attached to last car on a freight train. Next time your stuck at a RxR notice a red box hanging from the last car.
The unit is one of the reasons a caboose is not used.

The standard RFID chips are passive in that they do not read unless they are hit by a scanner. The passive chips are cheap if they are applicable.

Billy Allen told me at OSY worlds they use some type of RFID technology. Maybe he can give more input.

Tim

[Andrew 4CE]

To my knowledge, any RFID system has be used near a timing strip wire, or loop, or matt type setup. You'd have to install a wire under water or above the boats. no problem if a permanent location. Pretty tricky for temp sites.

[fourty-eight N]

the link provided by racer 3j clearly indicates wireless use. therefore no running of any cabling or wiring. seems simple to set up and operate. I definitely see how it could work, it would ease up the work on the judges stand and provide 100 percent accurate times. no more questionable gun jumpers/record setters.

[csh-2z]

If you're correct, it may be possible to input the information on the score sheets and eliminate the need for scorers. It would get awful lonely with only a referee and flag person on the judges stand. It may also be possible to flash the boat numbers of gun jumpers on your digital clock so the drivers know if they are legal or not, could prevent some accidents.

[18W]

I think your read range will be your limiting factor. The specs say 60'.

[bh/]

The NFL this season has placed them in footballs so as to determine legal field goals,
and intend to eventually use them for 1st downs/touchdowns and eliminate the yard sticks

[Ram4x4]

From what I've seen, motorsport based rfid timing systems start around $5,000 and up.

[racingfan1]

Would you really want to eliminate your scorers and timers? Electronics fail all the time. It would be advisable to keep them as a back up , just in case.

[KURPS]

Makes the boats radio controlled and get rid of the drivers!

[Ericwienczak]

Its always a pain getting people to volunteer for judges stand duty. Its an issue at every race ive been at. People can fail too. We had a 300 finals heat red flagged a few weeks ago because the judges couldnt tell who the 4 gun jumpers were. It didnt benefit anyone that was legal, and the jumpers got another shot at it

[Matt Dagostino]

Sounds cool.................but so did live streaming and we still can't seem to figure that out.....................wonder how the 'chip' works in the NFL footballs someone mentioned??

[Ram4x4]

I have a solution for this, guaranteed signal anywhere in the continental U.S. with broadband capabilities. The retail equipment is $995, plus bandwidth usage fees. We could possibly approach the company for special pricing or something in exchange for advertising (and the fact we would use bandwidth only in the summer and only on weekends).

[Ram4x4]

The football 'chip' is an active rfid tag with antennas around the stadium. Think of it like a mini GPS system, only much more accurate.

[bmitch1]

After some research on this involving a couple calls with suppliers of the technology - it appears this could be feasible..barring any unforseen challenges regarding logistics and minor details that always accompany new ideas.

The receiving antenna wire can be supported above the start/finish line and I was instructed that the entire loop can be a couple hundred feet away from the judges stand (one example I was given). We may need to create a set of buoys for the start/finish line with a vertical pole provided adequate elevation for the receiving wire - perhaps stabilized under the surface of the water similar to a sea anchor. Although we would need to consider how to deal with a situation where the buoy was removed by an errant race boat (and what problems might be created by a loop of antenna wire deposited into the water). I've not seen a situation where a boat hit a buoy mid-straightaway but l'm sure it's just a matter of 'when' and not 'if'.

A fully charged active RFID transmitter running 1,000 signals a second will run for up to 7 days before requiring a 3-hour recharge from a base charger. The rechargeable battery is good for up to 10 years. The unit itself could be attached either temporarily or permanently to the boat. As boat racers we may need to provide further assistance in waterproofing certain RFID transmitter models.

The decoder is capable of capturing several hundred transponders (for example, when used in a marathon foot race) so a 12 boat race won't be a challenge. Some systems come ready with the necessary software for scoring.

A more robust implementation would allow the races (by participant, RFID #) to be setup ahead of time, integrated to the countdown/race clock, and results posted to websites or on a WAN (in 4g challenged areas) to monitors on the beach.

Powered RFID transmitters will increase the cost vs passive models (think $100-$150 per transmitter - but it could be supplied by the local club, and/or used on multiple boats). The decoder is the most expensive component - ~$3,000 but does include software...and then the devil is in the details of how to setup, deploy and manage the system.

Food for thought.

[Ram4x4]

Active RFID tags (programmable) that work up to 400m can be had for $30 a piece. The decoder is the expensive part, and it has to match the frequency range of the tags.

If the loop based antenna is used, you don't need active tags, passives will work just as well.

I'd consider stretching the support line for the antenna from one shore to the other on poles, but you still have the loop antenna to deal with.

[adamallen]

This is where I would start...

http://finishtiming.com/index.php

They were contracted by the ChampBoat series about 8 or 9 years ago. I believe Mike the owner is a son of an engineer from Mercury.

[PittmanRacing]

I helped coach a middle school track team. They hired a small business that specialized in doing this. If you have ever been to a big track meet, with elimination heats, and fraction of seconds make a difference, technology is super. Fact is, it worked...without exception. For the meet, coaches had to submit runner names and they were assigned lanes, which could not be changed. With 6 qualifying heats, the system could quickly identify the 8 fastest and assign final start positions, speeding up the meet and accuracy. There was never any arguments. The small business that developed it charged about $300-500 per meet, depending on # of schools. Each team kicked in about $75 for timers, got super accurate results instantly (including the runners) and no begging for volunteers. Seems the same concept could be applied to boats and make it easier for all involved. Downside is initial cost and keeping drivers from messing with RFID's on their boat to gain some advantage.

[Ram4x4]

Yeah, rules about tag placement location on the boat would have to be drafted up.

[ryan_4z]

I've not seen a situation where a boat hit a buoy mid-straightaway but l'm sure it's just a matter of 'when' and not 'if'.

I've done this, a couple of different ways actually....

[Tim Weber]

Way to man up Ryno.