Questions for SORC

[ryan_4z]

I have some questions for the Commission members about the recent situation in CSH at the Northeast Divisionals.

1. Why was Scott Clark re-instated as the Northeast Divisional Champion, giving him a qualifying spot in the finals at the Nationals, when his motor was illegal?

2. On what grounds was the appeal made?

3. Is he going to be allowed to run this motor at the Nationals?

4. If he does run this motor, will he be disqualified?

5. If he is not disqualified, does that mean that port chamfering is now legal in CSH?

6. If he is disqualified, then why re-instate him in the first place?



I would just like to say that I am in no way trying to personally attack Scott, nor am I suggesting that he is a cheater. I personally do not think that he is a cheater, but his motor is illegal. This situation must be rectified before the Nationals, otherwise it will undoubtedly lead to much more complicated problems.

[HYDRO21Z]

I require an answer as well!!!

SORC
I also want this issue answered.
I have learned the facts about this event, and as a CSH driver and
participant at the upcoming national I want to know your response!

I agree with Ryan, I believe that Scott is not cheating, as he apparantly
had no knowledge of the chamfering of the port, however as I read the
rule book, and inquire of neutral inspectors his motor IS illegal as the
rule is written.
I have learned that such an improvement in that area could mean as
much as a boat length in speed advantage. I have inquired of my engine
builder and have been assured it is not chamfered
So my question again is how can my motor and Scott's both be legal?
SORC needs to solve this or quickly tell me how much I can chamfer
my motor to be competitve.


To Scott Clark:
I regret that you have to deal with this issue. I have nothing but respect for
you as you have always demonstrated character, and integrity on and off
the racecourse, however the subject must be addressed and remedied
before the Nationals.
Respectfully,
Dennis 21Z

[dholt]

Another question for SORC

While we're at it...anyone from the SORC or the Race Committee at the Central Divisionals in Depue got any info on how the "tie" between 2 CSH drivers will be handled for the Nationals qualifying spot?

Will both drivers be qualified...or neither? What is the answer?

Dana

[Big Don]

I'll answer the CSH question. After the chief scorer looked at the times it was determined that she had enough information to award the driver of 10 -W the win. I know everyone will want to know how she did that so let me try and explain. The time for 2nd,3rd & 4th for the one heat were lost due to a paper jam issue. If you took the 5th place time for that heat and add it to 10-W’s other heat time it was better than the other driver’s two times. And since 10-W actually got better than a 5th it was obvious that he actually was the winner and awarded the win. The other driver was awarded 2nd.

[dholt]

Thanks

Don.

Thanks for the info man. Glad to hear the issue was resolved.

2 1/2 weeks till the Big Show. Can't wait!

D.

[17W]

Dana...

I believe the Central Divisionals CSH Final issue has been rectified...a sole winner was awarded.


Don & I must have been posting @ the same time.

[D_Allen_III]

hey dana, is TRORA going to be running the annual Nationals competion again? I love going on there and trying to pick who's going to win every class. Still haven't been close to winning, but I got a good feeling about this year!

[Big Don]

I have some questions for the Commission members about the recent situation in CSH at the Northeast Divisionals.

1. Why was Scott Clark re-instated as the Northeast Divisional Champion, giving him a qualifying spot in the finals at the Nationals, when his motor was illegal?

2. On what grounds was the appeal made?

3. Is he going to be allowed to run this motor at the Nationals?

4. If he does run this motor, will he be disqualified?

5. If he is not disqualified, does that mean that port chamfering is now legal in CSH?

6. If he is disqualified, then why re-instate him in the first place?



I would just like to say that I am in no way trying to personally attack Scott, nor am I suggesting that he is a cheater. I personally do not think that he is a cheater, but his motor is illegal. This situation must be rectified before the Nationals, otherwise it will undoubtedly lead to much more complicated problems.

1. Because the commission ruled in favor of his appeal, therefore ruling that it was legal.

3. He can run any engine he wants, just like any of us can.

4. Inspector will determine that. If I remember correctly it was Mr. Runne that was the inspector at the divisionals maybe he can comment on this. How is he going to look at this. Will it change his thoughts on this issue since the commission put the driver back in?? Will he throw out the same engine again??? I would think if the inspector feels it is illegal he will make his decision appropriately. Then it’s up to the driver to decide if he is going to appeal and put it in the hands of the commission. The inspector is just doing his job. Therefore I think it is imperative that Ed let all Yamato drivers know ahead of time how he is going to rule on this.

5. If he is not disqualified then I would assume the inspector has change his stance on this. Could not agree with you more Ryan. I think that is what we may have done. ????

I think we owe it to all drivers to let them know prior to racing that there is a potential issue with their equipment. Weather it be this issue or another. This type of thing has happened in the past and it is not fair to the drivers. I don’t want to see us at Dayton having to throw drivers out and the SORC ruling on 50 appeals because no one knew prior where we stand on an issue. WE OWE IT TO THE DRIVERS!

[ryan_4z]

1. Because the commission ruled in favor of his appeal, therefore ruling that it was legal.

3. He can run any engine he wants, just like any of us can.

4. Inspector will determine that. If I remember correctly it was Mr. Runne that was the inspector at the divisionals maybe he can comment on this. How is he going to look at this. Will it change his thoughts on this issue since the commission put the driver back in?? Will he throw out the same engine again??? I would think if the inspector feels it is illegal he will make his decision appropriately. Then it’s up to the driver to decide if he is going to appeal and put it in the hands of the commission. The inspector is just doing his job. Therefore I think it is imperative that Ed let all Yamato drivers know ahead of time how he is going to rule on this.

5. If he is not disqualified then I would assume the inspector has change his stance on this. Could not agree with you more Ryan. I think that is what we may have done. ????

I think we owe it to all drivers to let them know prior to racing that there is a potential issue with their equipment. Weather it be this issue or another. This type of thing has happened in the past and it is not fair to the drivers. I don’t want to see us at Dayton having to throw drivers out and the SORC ruling on 50 appeals because no one knew prior where we stand on an issue. WE OWE IT TO THE DRIVERS!

1. Is there any way to get a copy of the appeal? I assume that Scott appealed on the grounds that the motor was illegal. But I have heard that the SORC re-instated him because there might be a lot of motors out there like his. Of course this was merely speculation on the part of the commission. Furthermore, if he was re-instated on the grounds that there could be many illegal motors currently racing, then what was the basis for that decision, being that his appeal was made on completely different grounds?

This decision was the easy way out, so that the commission did not have to deal with a tough situation. But the fact of the matter is, this decision was in no way good for our sport. A precedent was set here, that this modification is now acceptable. We MUST remedy this situation now, before it gets out of hand. We just did is the same thing as plugging the A motors all over again. Somebody has an illegal motor, but instead of disqualifying them, now the rest of us have to get our motors rebuilt. This issue will never go away if we don't stop it now. Years from now someone will still be *****ing about the time we modified the C class, and what a mistake it was. These motors are still pure, lets keep them that way.

4. The SORC essentially took away any power he has. They have made any techincal ruling by a inspector meaningless, unless they back it up through the appeals process. There is, and never was, any question that this motor is illegal. Yet the SORC arbitrarily decided to let it slide. If Scott runs this motor at the nationals, and is disqualified, is the SORC going to rule the same way again? If so, why even have a motor inspection?

[888race]

I am totally confused

If the inspector determines your motor is illegal then how can your appeal be overturned and if the motor is ran again and is determend to still be illegal then do you just appeal again at what point do we change the rule book to make it legal for all . And if there are alot of other motors out there like this then they are illegal too and must be brought to specs if you talk to the motor builers I am sure they would not agree with this ruleing WHAT A MESS !!!

[mercguy]

If the inspector determines your motor is illegal then how can your appeal be overturned and if the motor is ran again and is determend to still be illegal then do you just appeal again at what point do we change the rule book to make it legal for all . And if there are alot of other motors out there like this then they are illegal too and must be brought to specs if you talk to the motor builers I am sure they would not agree with this ruleing WHAT A MESS !!!

sure makes the PRO class's look better and better each day!!

[HYDRO21Z]

Inspectors and Engine builders speak up

If the inspector determines your motor is illegal then how can your appeal be overturned and if the motor is ran again and is determend to still be illegal then do you just appeal again at what point do we change the rule book to make it legal for all . And if there are alot of other motors out there like this then they are illegal too and must be brought to specs if you talk to the motor builers I am sure they would not agree with this ruleing WHAT A MESS !!!

I have heard from a number of Inspectors, and engine builders, and from
the ones I have spoken to the motor is illegal.

Again what is the point of inspection if an appeal can overrule the very
people who have the most knowledge and experience on the subject.

SORC please respond quickly, my motor leaves for the Nationals on the 2nd
of August, I only have 7 days to get my ports chamfered. I want to race
on equal terms or not at all!

[Big Don]

1. Is there any way to get a copy of the appeal? I assume that Scott appealed on the grounds that the motor was illegal. But I have heard that the SORC re-instated him because there might be a lot of motors out there like his. Of course this was merely speculation on the part of the commission. Furthermore, if he was re-instated on the grounds that there could be many illegal motors currently racing, then what was the basis for that decision, being that his appeal was made on completely different grounds?

This decision was the easy way out, so that the commission did not have to deal with a tough situation. But the fact of the matter is, this decision was in no way good for our sport. A precedent was set here, that this modification is now acceptable. We MUST remedy this situation now, before it gets out of hand. We just did is the same thing as plugging the A motors all over again. Somebody has an illegal motor, but instead of disqualifying them, now the rest of us have to get our motors rebuilt. This issue will never go away if we don't stop it now. Years from now someone will still be *****ing about the time we modified the C class, and what a mistake it was. These motors are still pure, lets keep them that way.

4. The SORC essentially took away any power he has. They have made any techincal ruling by a inspector meaningless, unless they back it up through the appeals process. There is, and never was, any question that this motor is illegal. Yet the SORC arbitrarily decided to let it slide. If Scott runs this motor at the nationals, and is disqualified, is the SORC going to rule the same way again? If so, why even have a motor inspection?

1. Don’t think there is a way for you to see it but that would be up to the Stock V.P. Not sure if it is proper etiquette to show someone else’s appeal to the masses.

4. Don’t think we have taken his power away but it is certainly a hot topic and can’t believe it took someone this long to bring it up. I agree with you that it needs to be really clear what our stance is prior to Dayton. I don’t see how we can rule any differently if the same engine is run as it was at the divisionals? But as we all know this sport can produce some crazy outcomes. Would that be fair to the driver??? Is that fair to the rest of the drivers???? Once again this needs to be settled prior to Dayton.

I want it to be real clear I am in no way answering for the SORC I’m just stating my opinions. I am not even close to being an inspector. But from what I understand didn’t some of these engines come from Japan with inconsistencies in the ports and chamfering? These engines have passed nationals inspections for years and now were going to start throwing them out??? It sounds like there are engine builders/inspectors that disagree with the Divisionals Inspector.

This has been one of our main issues for years… Different inspectors & engine builders have different theories and opinions. Just as boat builders have different theories and opinions with each ohter. That is what makes this sport tuff to deal with. Going thru inspection at a nationals is one of the most strenuous things to have to deal with. You can pass 4 nationals inspections and then a different year with a different inspector and who knows…
Ryan no disrespect but we need others to chime in. So if I don’t answer your response it’s nothing personal.

I for one am going back outside and measureing my boat numbers again.

[mike ross]

I think the big issue was we didn't have anything in the inspection manuel that addressed chamfering for the Yamato engine. So how can you throw someone out when we don't have a rule pertaining to it. Several engine builders do this and it is even recomended in some of the tech manuals I have seen produced. It is almost impossible to measure a block in the field. I agree with the SORC on there ruling. Lets try to keep inspection as simple as we can. If you want to be technical we could find a bunch of things to start throwing guys out for. Mike

[dholt]

Why

Hey Ryan...or anyone who was at Whitney Pt.

Why exactly was Clark DQ'd in the first place?

And Don...I'm sure we can fire up the "Nationals" contest on our website.

Have you checked out the trivia questions on there???

D.