The future of Merc in "J" ???

[B Walker]

I am modifying my post to be more on topic, originally I was discussing the Merc in A, but it seems there is more of an issue of its future in J as I have learned the Merc will be removed from A.

Q) Do the modifications allowed for the Mercury 15 violate the philosophy and ideals of J class?

It is looking like this will be the hot topic of this years Annnual Meeting and I would like to see a constructive discussion here of the pros and cons for the Mercury 15 to meet the goals and requirements of J and AX.

Brad Walker

[Big Don]

What class in SO has a competitive out-of-the-box with as little modification as possible, form of outboard racing? Other than sidewinder... and in that case your paying up front for it.

[blueskyracer]

What class in SO has a competitive out-of-the-box with as little modification as possible, form of outboard racing? Other than sidewinder... and in that case your paying up front for it.

That sure is the truth. Well said

[B Walker]

Yamato 302 has very few modifications and all are low cost.

So, with Sidewinder fully implemented and Yamato 302 I count ASH, ASR, BSH, BSR, 25SSH, 25SSR, CSH, CSR, 20SSH all meeting the "competitive out-of-the-box with as little modification as possible, form of outboard racing" standard.

9 for 11 is not bad considering we are at 3 for 11 now.

Only 2 left for the SORC to work on, hahaha (joke)

BW

[26V]

Not sure how little you need to do to the 302, but you did miss one motor
and that is the D motor the tohatsu.

[burl11]

Wasn't the Merc Already Tossed from A??

It is looking like this will be the hot topic of this years Annnual Meeting and I would like to see a constructive discussion here of the pros and cons for the Mercury 15 to stay or go in A Stock.

Brad Walker

I think this was decided last year. See the excerpt below from the Stock Outboard annual meeting minutes:

70. Proposal to Remove the Mercury as an eligible motor in the A class. Motion made. Second. Discussion. Vote taken and tied. Tie broken by Chairman Reed. Motion passed. Jeff Brewster noted as voting against it.

There must be more to the logic to remove the Merc than meets the eye. If a current manufacturer is making motors available through the APBA, would you not want to use that motor in A? I am not aware that OMC is making new motors available, yet they are kept in the class.

There must be other reasons for this decision that are less than obvious, and I am sure they could be explained. Last year's meeting minutes did not contain any discussion on the vote.

[Nilsen Racing]

The future of Mercury in (not only) A, but J?

Not meaning to step on anyone's thread here, but regarding the Mercury did anyone notice the Kilo records set in JH and JR this past weekend at Devils Lake? Since people have figured out how to legally plug holes in the Mercury the JH Kilo record is now 43.702 mph and the JR Kilo record is now 40.015. First, I want to say great job by both young Mr. Olson and Mr Smith. In know way do I want to take anything away from their accomplishments as they are totally within the rules and on top of that they are both great kids. But, does APBA need to start thinking about what might be considered a safe speed for the average J racer? In other words, is the Mercury now getting to the point where it is to fast for J??? Please believe me when I say I'm not taking sides here, since my sons are long out of J and given the same situation, I'd be doing the same thing. A little red flag just went up in my mind when I heard the speeds.

Maybe (maybe not) an agenda item for the J committee to discuss at the National Meeting?


My thoughts only
Jim

[B Walker]

There are two notes in the 2009 J Committee National Meeting minutes about J's going too fast......and that is at last years speeds.

http://www.apba-racing.com/Forms/200...eigh,%20NC.pdf

I expect it to be a hot topic.

I have no idea how to put the genie back in the bottle.

BW

[Matt Dagostino]

Tom,

There must be more to the logic to remove the Merc than meets the eye. If a current manufacturer is making motors available through the APBA, would you not want to use that motor in A? I am not aware that OMC is making new motors available, yet they are kept in the class.

There must be other reasons for this decision that are less than obvious, and I am sure they could be explained. Last year's meeting minutes did not contain any discussion on the vote.

The reason for the removal of the Merc was mostly due to the fact that the "Sidewinder Contingent" saw the engine as a threat to it's program.

For better or worse that's the bottom line as "Stone Cold Steve Austin Would Say"..................

Have a nice day

[B Walker]

The chicken or the egg

The Merc was no threat to the Sidewinder program until significant modifications were allowed.

Intended or not, we now have a situation where J's are going faster than most ever intended because of these modifications. This speed has come at an additional cost of ownership. In the process, the percentage of speed difference between out-of-the-box-stock and blueprinted has become one of the largest in outboard racing.

Summary

1)J's are faster than intended

2)Cost of ownership has increased for the Mercury 15

3)The knowledge and effort required for a new J racer to immediately compete has increased. (most important point for an "entry level" class)

This is big picture stuff. Ask yourself what is best for outboard racing.

BW

[Fast Jack]

cost of J

Brad, we have 3 local kids with Merc motors in J. One is bone stock out of the box. The only modification is the restriction of the water passage in the thermostat housing. The cost.... less than 1 dollar.. He is very competative and placed 2nd in region 1. Another motor has new Mercury 15 hp rings, He won both days at Kingston. The third has been Honed and rings replaced , He won the high points for South Shore Outboard. I dont think any of these items added much to the cost of a season of racing.. This is RACING . You will never stop a racer from trying to go faster. The Merc has come a long way but by far is the best bang for the buck out of the box. I had an almost new OMC J motor. never been apart, raced 2 times . It was a gamble if it would get on plane. let alone run with the field. I think the J merc is doing exactly as intended. Run out of the box and be competative . Lets look at the facts- Most J drivers are the kids of Racers ,some with years of family members in the sport. I dont personally know any one who has entered J "off the street"

[thepiranhabros]

Um... yes!

...does APBA need to start thinking about what might be considered a safe speed for the average J racer? In other words, is the Mercury now getting to the point where it is to fast for J??? Please believe me when I say I'm not taking sides here, since my sons are long out of J and given the same situation, I'd be doing the same thing. A little red flag just went up in my mind when I heard the speeds.

My thoughts only
Jim

Well thought, Jim.

[propnuts]

Good points all

The chicken or the egg

The Merc was no threat to the Sidewinder program until significant modifications were allowed.

Intended or not, we now have a situation where J's are going faster than most ever intended because of these modifications. This speed has come at an additional cost of ownership. In the process, the percentage of speed difference between out-of-the-box-stock and blueprinted has become one of the largest in outboard racing.

Summary

1)J's are faster than intended

2)Cost of ownership has increased for the Mercury 15

3)The knowledge and effort required for a new J racer to immediately compete has increased. (most important point for an "entry level" class)

This is big picture stuff. Ask yourself what is best for outboard racing.

BW

This also goes back to what I pointed out on another thread, the reason the Merc was removed from A is that is is still a moving (it appears from where I sit a RAPIDLY moving) target. If the Sidewinder was targeted for Merc speeds last year it would be slower than the Merc this year, and we all expect that trend will continue for a few years to come.

[B1PRORACER]

J speeds...

About the J speeds.... We have to keep in mind that these speeds are kilo records and are actually historical TOP speeds. Not every J will go this fast! My son has been racing only a year and is 13 years old. Now- after running KPRO at the nationals, my son wants to go faster than J.....!

[csh2z]

Daren,
WHAT?!!! Not meaning to question your integrity but that is not what we (SORC)were told. What is your source?