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Sidewinder update from White Haven

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  • Sidewinder update from White Haven

    Took my first ride with a Sidewinder this weekend at White Haven. There were 4 boats in BSH (Dom, Stillwell, Captain America, and me). We improved the performance of the motor over the 4 heats of the weekend (when I say we, really it was Ed Runne, Scott Clark, and Scott Reed who did the improving, I was just the test pilot and they translated my feedback/impressions into something useable). The short version is the Sidewinder will run with the Hot Rod on the top end right now but it still loses too many rpm in the corner. The feeling in the boat was very comparable to my BSH ride at Constantine 2 weeks ago with a Hot Rod. The more detailed description of the weekend is below for anyone who is interested.

    There are a few pictures posted of us taching the motor (13F boat, Race 4 KAOS shirt blocks the motor). Also there is a picture of it on stands by the water. I'm hoping someone got some pictures of it on the water.

    The first heat on Sat. we set the boat up a little less conservatively than I had it set up at Constantine with a Hot Rod, but there is still room to go up & out with the motor. I didn't want to get too crazy with the set up since I only had 3 heats in the boat prior to this weekend. I was able to run to the first turn with everyone but carb issues caused the motor to really drop rpm when I turned the wheel and it probably dropped 1500 to 2000 rpm by the exit pin of the turn. Ed adjusted the carb between heats and made some improvement, the motor didn't really drop rpm until the 2nd pin of the turn and lost maybe 1000 to 1500 rpm by the exit pin. After racing ended on Sat. Ed and Scott Clark and Scott Reed went to work on the carb using a test wheel. I held on to the boat and tried to absorb as much of the info as I could since I know nothing about Lectron carbs. The throttle response was definitely improved and overall the motor seemed better throughout the rpm range. Heat 1 of Sun. I got a great run at the clock along with everyone else and we stayed bunched until the first turn, I think I might have been pulling George a little bit to the turn but maybe that's wishful thinking. Since I wasn't sure about the carb changes we made overnight I didn't drive to the pin (didn't want it to bog and have George run in to me). This time the motor slowly dropped rpm in the turn instead of an abrupt drop in rpm like on Sat. also I only lost maybe 1000 rpm by the exit pin(it was definitely better than Sat.). For the 2nd heat Ed advanced the timing slightly. This may have slightly helped the top end but didn't correct the rpm loss in the corners. Sorry for the rpm loss approximations, I wasn't running a tach in the boat, so it is only my impression based on change in how the motor sounded. I'll run with a tach when I get a chance to go testing.

    Thanks again to Scott Clark, Scott Reed and Ed Runne for all their help with the Sidewinder this weekend.

    I'll have the motor at Zanesville (7/12 ~ 7/13) and at Akron (7/19 ~ 7/20) hopefully I'll be able to race it at both places and continue to make improvements.

  • #2
    Right on Dudley!

    Right on, thanks for the information and thanks to everyone working on the project. This is very exciting news! It sounds like Ed is getting it closer on closer.

    Very cool stuff.

    12M



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    • #3
      The Sidwinder was as fast on top end as Dudley said we ran side by side to the first turn and the one heat he got there before I did. With out the bog in the turn it would be very competitive. After talking with Eddie I think the issue was the float level not being high enough causing it to loose fuel in the turns.All in all the motor ran very well there.
      Destiny is a matter of chance,it is a matter of choice; it is not a thing to be waited for, it is a thing to be achieved.

      Comment


      • #4
        How is the engine on the low end and through mid range to the pipe? Is it a fairly smooth transition, or, is this an on or off type of power curve?
        Bill Schwab
        Miss KTDoodle #62C
        -Naturescape encinitas landscape company

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        • #5
          Low and mid range

          Sorry about the delay in response. I posted right before I left for GA yesterday and wasn't up to posting last night when I arrived.

          The motor seems to pull strong all along the rpm range, you don't notice a sudden kick in the pants like with a turbo motor with bad turbo lag or like when VTEC kicks in on a Honda or Acura (car reference). The 2nd heat of Sunday I was early on the start so I backed off to almost off plane to stay legal. Probably because of the dire consequences threatened if I finished last and jumping the gun in a 4 boat race is a quick way to do that (for the record the threat did not come from Ed, Scott or Scott). Maybe I should just claim I wanted to check its acceleration because I'm a very thorough test pilot. Anyway the motor accelerated nicely and I got to the first turn not too far behind the other 3 boats which had better starts than I did (about a quarter to half lap behind which is what they pulled on me at the start).

          Also the boat jumped on plane quickly and easily.

          Hope this answers your questions, if not ask in a slightly different way and I'll blame my misunderstanding on brain fog due to driving so many hours.

          I only ran one prop and one set up for the weekend. I had a second prop there but since we were making so many carb adjustments I decided to minimize the variables.

          I'm hoping to get it on the back of the boat this weekend and do some testing. If I do I'll post some more objective info. If not I'll try to answer any questions with the subjective info from this weekend's race and the upcoming races. My intent is to have at least one good test session and a couple more race weekends before the Nationals at Whitney Pt.

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          • #6
            Pretty cool. Next time out have somebody take some video. Would be neat so see since we don't have any sidewinders here on the west coast
            Sean Byrne



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            • #7
              video

              I'll see what I can do. If the earlier rumors are true, the Akron race will be televised at least partially on Sports Time Ohio (a northeast Ohio cable sports channel, Cleveland Indians games, etc.) If that's the case I may be able to get some very good footage.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Dudley13F View Post
                I'll see what I can do. If the earlier rumors are true, the Akron race will be televised at least partially on Sports Time Ohio (a northeast Ohio cable sports channel, Cleveland Indians games, etc.) If that's the case I may be able to get some very good footage.
                You are only getting on TV if you get that baby out front and can do a post race interview circa John Force.

                "Yeah, the Smith Racing sponsored, Sidewinder powered, Team Racecraft BSH is a fast little hot rod!"
                Brian 10s

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                • #9
                  broadcast definite?

                  So is STO definitely broadcasting?

                  Since you're running all Mod & all Stock, I may get 2 chances to for a post race interview. Of course that may require some assistance from my fellow competitors (like at Constantine) or a really productive test session this weekend. Too bad it isn't like NASCAR where you can have an adult beverage during the post race interview.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    a couple questions...

                    For those of us interested in this motor who also don't know anything about Lectron carberators, would someone mind explaining how they work in terms (what all is adjusted, etc) that folks who have only dealt with carbs on Yamatos and OMCs can understand?

                    Does Ed intend to make some of these carb and timing adjustments at the factory in order to get the motors closer to optimum performance out of the box, or are new owners going to have to work through the same issues? The answer to the first question impacts this one, because if the carbs are as simple as turning a needle valve, and/or checking a float level, then the "issues" wouldn't be a big deal.

                    Thanks in advance.
                    Mike Johnson

                    World Headquarters
                    sigpic
                    Portland, Oregon
                    Johnson Racing

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                    • #11
                      Mike they should be very close on timing and the carb when they leave Eddie. Thats what all the tweaking is for thats going on now.
                      Destiny is a matter of chance,it is a matter of choice; it is not a thing to be waited for, it is a thing to be achieved.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        How it works, Lectron

                        http://www.lectronfuelsystems.com/index.htm

                        This web site has all the detail you want about the lectron Card. It is different than a butterfly.

                        It is a flat guillotine with a metering rod at its base that dips into the float bowl at the bottom of the carb, the fuel follows the shape of the flat side of the metering rod to mix with the air in the carbs bore. The metering rod has several different shapes to increase or decrease fuel flow at different percentages of throttle position or guillotine position. Then at near full throttle there is a high speed or power jet that adds additional fuel directly from the float bowl.

                        This combination and position is something you can play with to help performance at different altitudes and humidity conditions the same way you turn the needle at the base of your Yamato carb.

                        From the factory you will have a set up that performs very well.

                        That combination is getting ironed out right now.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Cross Country Racing

                          Brian,
                          Also it's Cross Country Racing for me, I think Smith Racing is Tommy Smith.

                          For the Lectron carbs the metering needles have 2 numbers the first which tells the setting for the high rpm range and the second which tells the setting for the low rpm range (I think I'm using the correct terminology). The numbers are printed vertically on the metering needles.

                          For example: 6 3
                          Last edited by Dudley13F; 07-03-2008, 08:21 PM. Reason: formatting error

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                          • #14
                            That carb is a "rip off" of the old Mikuni's that SST mini bikes used from the 60's.

                            Yamaha engines were similar, but the carb had a cylinder style slide bore.

                            Even down to the dual float design, very similar
                            Bill Schwab
                            Miss KTDoodle #62C
                            -Naturescape encinitas landscape company

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                            • #15
                              Skoontz...... I don't get your comment. Is that a good or a bad thing??
                              Sean Byrne



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