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[Big Don]

Bill non taken, I guess I need to be careful how I say things because I agree you can find information in the 93 survey.

My main point was everyone has their reasons and sometimes they hide behind other reasons and you may not get the real story.

The other point I was trying to make was there are over 40 comments as to reasons why they quit and in today’s world there could be many more.

But I agree with you that there is good information in there.

I’ll just say this, in our family that started with Don Sr. we have had 12 of Don’s family race over the years. Only 1 of them really currently races.

Here’s what I think the reason are for those that started and never continued in our family. I’ll just number them so as to not offend any of them. Some of them will be obvious. LOL

1 – raced for 40 years and retired
1 – raced J and never went on…..lost interest/was not fun???
1 – raced J and a few other spotty classes…… lost interest/was not fun????
1 – raced J and other classes………… politics
1 – raced 25 years, had 5 kids could not afford it, has bad knees, broke from 5 kids, kid took equipment and races it, has too much fun harassing Mike Pavlick.
1 – raced for a few years……lost interest/was not fun?????
1 – raced for several years…..has a bad back
1 – raced on and off and quite honestly was horrible at it….Don stopped loaning equipment before he hurt himself or someone else
1 – raced for 10 plus years…financial/lost interest
1 – raced for 7 years…..financial
1 – raced a couple years….has other interest right now and races occasionally
1 – still racing

[Ron Hill]

Maybe, I Didn't Really Know Joe Schulte

Dave, I can shed some light on this subject, as I AM that guy. I was involved in hydroplane racing all my life. Stock outboards as well as inboards. The quick answer is politics. I dont know how else to describe a situation where a guy can run coast to coast without losing a single heat including BOTH divisionals as well as the nationals and Dayton, And the guy who finished 2nd at the western divisionals and 3rd at the nationals gets in the hall of champions, while the guy who won everything was not even mentioned. Same class. My father was bitter about that until the day he died. I felt as though APBA did not want racers like us. I am blue collar guy who races on a string budget as a hobby. When they started making rules about uniforms and capsules in inboards, I was done. It felt like those rules were aimed directly at people like me. I think it burned somebody's butt that most of our hardware was home made and not anodized and we would show up with the boat needing a paint job as it was half primer and the chrome and imron boats were left fighting for second place. I miss the days you could show up towing the boat behind a pickup truck and a small carry toolbox and win the nationals. I thought I was all done racing until I moved to Texas and discovered NBRA. As soon as I saw their tag line "Grass roots racing with you in mind" I was interested. Heck, the whole rule book is only 85 pages, and that includes the member directory. Finally, I am excited about boat racing again. I am going to show up with my boat behind my pickup and I am going to have fun this year. If you go to the local motocross track, thats what you see...families showing up in trucks with the bike in the back and little johhny gets to race. let's not lose sight of the people we want to include. BTW, I still have the boat that went undefeated all those years ago, and it is under restoration. I will probably NEVER bring it to an APBA vintage event, because of all the restrictions, rules, regulations, and mostly the politics. Those guys are all nuts. You can't just show up and participate unless you fit the mold of what THEY deem appropriate. So, the oldest Ron Jones cabover in existence will become my lake toy. APBA is definately NOT for me. Joe John Schulte

After reading your post, I thought maybe, I didn't know Joe Schulte. I thought I knew him. When I broke the CU Kilo record in 1964, I broke Joe's record...


I happened to be reading "The Great Boat Race" and saw this about Joe winning C Runabout. at the Winnebagoland Marathon.

The inter net has to be good for boat racing, as ideas and feels surface. See, Joe never was an officer in our club, never really worked to put on any races. I always kind of felt he didn't care that much. He showed up, raced......

In inboards, I think even today, you have to write a letter to the Inboard Commission and TELL them what you did. When I went to Detroit for an APBA Meeting a few years back, I was shocked to see Dave Rankin not in the Hall of Champions. His Wild Child had ever race, they raced all over the USA.....I was told he never wrote the Commission to apply.

I know Joe did will in the inboard division, too. But, I thought he never cared about awards, he was never at any awards parties, that I recall.

I could write many pages about Joe's racing, incuding him almost winning the CU Nationals with a BORROWED D HYDRO prop.....But I will write that some other day.

[joejohn44]

After reading your post, I thought maybe, I didn't know Joe Schulte. I thought I knew him. When I broke the CU Kilo record in 1964, I broke Joe's record...


I happened to be reading "The Great Boat Race" and saw this about Joe winning C Runabout. at the Winnebagoland Marathon.

The inter net has to be good for boat racing, as ideas and feels surface. See, Joe never was an officer in our club, never really worked to put on any races. I always kind of felt he didn't care that much. He showed up, raced......

In inboards, I think even today, you have to write a letter to the Inboard Commission and TELL them what you did. When I went to Detroit for an APBA Meeting a few years back, I was shocked to see Dave Rankin not in the Hall of Champions. His Wild Child had ever race, they raced all over the USA.....I was told he never wrote the Commission to apply.

I know Joe did will in the inboard division, too. But, I thought he never cared about awards, he was never at any awards parties, that I recall.

I could write many pages about Joe's racing, incuding him almost winning the CU Nationals with a BORROWED D HYDRO prop.....But I will write that some other day.

Ron, thank you for remembering. My father was an intense competitor. He cared about winning. and he was very disappointed in the year he went undefeated with no recognition. He was under the impression a person got nominated by the region chairman. Your point that it is up to the individual is the first time I ever heard that. He wanted the recognition for his accomplishments, but would have never even considered being the one to point them out. He started Paw Paw Lake racing club in Michigan and put on several races both outboard and inboard, some of them even using our family property as pits. I too, could write a book about him with stories like Rod Zapf in a panic after asking him for help at Firebird lake because somebody had a little speed on him and dad beat on his prop layed over a trailer hitch ball with a brass hammer until he had drawn a crowd and Rod begging him to quit. Rod walked away from the guy the next heat...or the time Chip Hannour (sp?) thanked him for the driving lesson...I've got a million of them. But getting dressed up to go to a banquet was not his idea of a good time...while everyone else was at the banquet, he was in the garage...Thanks for stirring up the memories. Joe John BTW...He won the Winnebagoland twice...58 and 60...I know Russ won it in 59...

[joejohn44]

Joe,

You can bet your last dollar you are not the only one to show up at an NBRA race with a boat in the back of your truck, motors in the backseat, and win some races. Last year my Dad hauled my SEH in the back of his truck, powerhead in the open box in a garbage bag. Some tools, some other things important, like a cooler for beer and the lawn chairs for all the fun after the races sitting around and telling the competition you are gonna put a whupping on them tomorrow. (by the way, it is a good way to get free beer as they want to get you to drunk to race.... hehehe). Dad ended up winning the Nationals and high points in my SEH rig. And we showed up with our stuff in the back of his truck.

Welcome to the NBRA, you have a few racers in your area. Look up Gardner Miller, Dennise Burke, and a few others I can give you contact info for if you want. Main thing is, toss that boat in the back and come have some fun with the rest of us grass roots folks. I'll bring a rattle can of paint for ya if you need it. If you need help with anything, hollar.

Thanks Dave. I already have hooked up with the guys you mentioned. I am soooo looking forward to this year...And I plan to come after you maybe next year in SEH...LOL. this year I am training a new driver and get used to the boat racing lifestyle again.... Gather some SEH stuff...then its ON!!!! See You in the pits!!!

[bill van steenwyk]

You would think that the Inboard Category......

.........would have enough pride in it's competitor's and the Category itself to want to honor the drivers that won championships, set records, and other things that would qualify those drivers for the HOC, and they (the drivers) would not have to "toot their own horn" to get that recognition.

I started to say I find that way of doing things hard to believe, but I have seen enough things like it in APBA since 1968 that nothing much surprises me anymore.

If as stated (making the driver apply himself by listing his accomplishments to the commission category) and I have no reason to disbelieve two separate posters, no wonder boat racing of all types is in the shape it is. You would think the Category (with leadership from APBA) would have the criteria in place as most of them do and have done for years, with a certain number of points for the different accomplishments such as records on closed course and Kilo, National and Divisional Championships, etc, and the based on those totals the most deserving get in the HOC.

I started to say this is somewhat shocking that what I and others have always looked at as one of the premier categories in APBA did not seem to have more pride in driver accomplishments than stated. Since the HOC is an overall APBA accomplishment, it does not speak well of them either, that they would not take the lead in helping to establishing criteria for one of it's premier categories. Probably a side result of this is the loss of many of the documented records and results set in the Inboard category.

[Ron Hill]

Some Observations......

The APBA Inboard category STILL has their own awards banquet at the APBA National Meeting. I feel INBOARDERS felt their awards were more IMPORTANT and if you wanted in the HOC, that was your concern. Things may have changed, lately on how an Inboarder gets in the HOC.

BUT.........

When I was in college, I didn't play ball. I raced boats, was in a fraternity, in student government and chased women. I was actually fairly good at all four endeavors.

I had this theory with women. I told them, I sat on the top of my LADDER. If they wanted any part of me, they had to know I was "THE KING" of my ladder. I often said, "Other ladders are taller, but this is MY LADDER."

It became very clear to me, about 1979, when Region 12 hosted the APBA National Meeting and I was Region 12 Chairman, that APBA had many people sitting on the top of their OWN ladder. The trouble was no one could see the other ladders because they also had their own rooms.

No one wanted to get off their ladder to go see what the Go karts were doing for fear of losing their ladder. So, like American politicians, job one was to keep their ladder.

Look at the great ORGANIZATIONS: Penske, Apple, NASCAR.....They have or had a LEADER. They might have people sitting on ladders, but those people REPORT to the LEADER.

I talked to A.J Foyt one day....I'm still surprised he's shorter than I, but I told him he needed an organization. The days of getting out of your car and fixing it with a hammer is over. He tried to build and organization, but he wasn't a great leader. He was a great driver.

My fear with Crown Partners is they AREN"T really the leader of APBA.

It is easy for me to sell propellers, because I make propellers. It seems to me, APBA should have like 6 core classes that THEY SELL. That they promote races for these core classes.

I'm not trying to be negative, I'm telling it how is see it.

[bill boyes]

We are a membership driven volunteer organization. We do have leadership, However, Many do not want to be Lead, Follow or get out of the way. They rather b****,Moan and offer no real solutions to anything except find fault. That is human nature. Just read this site and most posts. Mostly someone getting on their soapbox. Lots of wasted energy in my opinion.

[daveracerdsh]

Bill/Ron

I sorta laughed when I read Ron Hill's post that he was suprised that he was taller then AJ Foyt.....I am maybe 5-9, pretty much average, and I found out that most of the Indy car drivers are very small...along the lines of 5-6 140lbs. (well, not that small) I used to have my hydros painted at an Indy car shop in Redmond Washington, and they had an Indy car there fresh out of the paint shop. I asked the owner of the place if I could sit in it, and he sorta laughed and said go ahead. I could not get my shoulders into the cockpit it was so tight....and the owner said they build the cars around the drivers....I was like...this is so cool..lol. Also...if think about it...we have so many classes spread amongst 6 catagories and few drivers...its like...wow. No wonder why we are in trouble. Bill also hits the nail on the head. When we got the new 302SSH class passed, I was honestly stunned at the number of people that sent me negative e mails and also personel attacks. All we are trying to do is help APBA grow. And it is true..most of the people that send me really nasty emails are those people that do NOTHING to help the sport grow...all they do is ***** and moan. Well hey, you can ***** and moan all you want when APBA is dead and buried if we don't turn things around. Positive energy...positive energy. Just my two cents worth.

[joejohn44]

We are a membership driven volunteer organization. We do have leadership, However, Many do not want to be Lead, Follow or get out of the way. They rather b****,Moan and offer no real solutions to anything except find fault. That is human nature. Just read this site and most posts. Mostly someone getting on their soapbox. Lots of wasted energy in my opinion.

Bill, I was not moaning or complaining, I was just answering a question posed by Dave Mason about why people quit. Did not mean anything else by it. just trying to put forth one mans reasons...just for the record and to repond to the original post, I dont think a new logo will attract new racers or convince former racers to return. Joe John

[Ron Hill]

Joe G. Schulte Thread

http://www.boatracingfacts.com/forum...052#post117052

I started a thread on BRF for Joe G. Schulte, seems that "G" was in the middle of his name.

Did your dad ever tell you how he almost drown at the Modesto Nationals, 1964???

Speak your mind always! I was wrong once! I think!

[bill boyes]

Joe John. My post was not directed at you. Say hello to your mother for me.
Your Dad did get into trouble at the Modesto Nationals. It was a real hot day and I think Your dad, Jack Seacrest, Ron Hill I think, and myself went for a beer way from the race site. On the return a irrigation canal sure looked looked good for a swim. They all went in except me. Well the water moves in these canals pretty swift and the sides are concrete and slick. Well your Dad could not get out and was in trouble. I ran down to a small bridge and leaned over and was able to crab your Dads hand and pull him to the side. he was well on his way down stream. He thought it was real funny and slapped his knees like he used to do.
Not lets get back to the Logo topic.

[jtower3941]

APBA Logo

The current APBA Logo has many supportors and and a number of problems if it were to be changed. Let us design a add on sticker that fits under the current logo, or can be put anywhere you want, that project the message that we want about our racers and sport. We have talanted people in our racing family. Lets get those that are interested in positive results and have the talant together and make it happen. Use your energy in a positive manner and STOP *****ING ABOUT IT and move toward something that will help our racing family and sport.
Just my .02 cents.

JTower 118P the old one.

[Kip69w]

Yikes !

Whoah, This was awesome He sayin' it -how it is !