APBA vote on sscale certification

[Skoontz]

Ok, we opened the ballot regarding scales at sectional/national events. It appears that someone wants to see scales certified at these events. So, before KT casts her vote, tell us any experiences you or someone you now may have had with inaccurate scales that were not certifed....

Now I'll share my knowledge.

We weigh between 13 and 30 trucks a day, 6 times a piece when we run gravel. By law, all scales must be certified in this nazi state that conduct acts of commerce.

Any one or 5 scales, on the same day will show different weights, weather certified or not. Once a scale is dialed in for the day, so long as no one messes with it, it will be accurate.

This rule will do nothing more than add another yet costly layer of red tape and allow Uncle Sam to to stuff his nose in a place where it does not belong.

So, unless anyone can offer a real life experience, my vote, is ABSOLUTELY HELL NO!!!!! We are very open to hear other opinions, so please before we cast the vote, lay it on us.

[mercguy]

Reread It!!

Ok, we opened the ballot regarding scales at sectional/national events. It appears that someone wants to see scales certified at these events. So, before KT casts her vote, tell us any experiences you or someone you now may have had with inaccurate scales that were not certifed....

Now I'll share my knowledge.

We weigh between 13 and 30 trucks a day, 6 times a piece when we run gravel. By law, all scales must be certified in this nazi state that conduct acts of commerce.

Any one or 5 scales, on the same day will show different weights, weather certified or not. Once a scale is dialed in for the day, so long as no one messes with it, it will be accurate.

This rule will do nothing more than add another yet costly layer of red tape and allow Uncle Sam to to stuff his nose in a place where it does not belong.

So, unless anyone can offer a real life experience, my vote, is ABSOLUTELY HELL NO!!!!! We are very open to hear other opinions, so please before we cast the vote, lay it on us.

you need to REREAD the ballot, it is NOT about certifying the scales (WHICH IS DONE AND NEEDED), but rather the scales being made 1hr prior to the racing, versus the 2hrs it is now. Before you ***** and whine about this subject, you might want to understand the purpose of this ballot issue, as you missed it completely!

The scales already have to be certified prior to championship events and should be.

PS: the rule change would allow the "volunteers" more breathing room and not require them to be at inspection so early.

[Skoontz]

Once again Daren, I ask for input.

You equate a simple request for input to whining. It's not whining. You ask me to reread the ballot....I have...


Scales do not need state certification as long as they are consistent.

Secondly,. Portable scales continually get knocked out of whack simply by the way they are handled, that's typically how we beat overweight tickets from DOT consistently. If you had any dealings with them other than dropping a boat one them once a month you might know that.

Thirdly, What will happen if/when there are so many boats waiting to weigh that it cannot be done in an hour? Fourth.

Both rules state that it shall not be possible to protest or appeal the accuracy of the scales. This should be changed to the same wording, so long as the scale shows consistent weighing a designated time during calibration.

I understand not everyone knows everything like you, we are all lessor beings. you're a regular freeking legend in your own mind, so thanks for taking the second to throw out the barbs.

[Jack Stotts]

The requirement to have a certified scales at Divisionals and Nationals has been on the books for a very long time. The only change in the ballot item is the time the scales are to be available prior to the start of racing. Bear in mind that the proposal is for Stock only as the Mods have a different cert. requirement. My comment on the proposal is that having someone at the course 2 hrs before the start is good. By keeping this requirement, race officials will be there early and perhaps lead to starting on time which in my experience would be a welcome change. A volunteer is not a necessity.

[ricochet112]

Because our (boat racers) scales sit for half the year I feel it's a good idea to have them inspected (certified) before an important event.

If your club doesn't do a Divisional or National event then the certification becomes a mute point.

All a no vote will do is make the inspector "HAVE" to be at the open scales 2 hours before the event, instead of 1 hour before the event.

PS, I feel sorry for you if you think of CA as a Nazi state, that's very sad.

[modhydro]

Scales

Can you please define "consistent" for us then? Without a certification, what will define the consistency? Would you travel across the country to a championship event and be happy with a weight method that somebody simply told you is consistent without anything to back it up? People spend far too much time and money to not have this be done.

As far as too many boats needing to be weighed in an hour; have you ever had to wait that long? Not all boats will be in the first heat or even first flight for that matter. There is plenty of time to get checked throughout the day. I've never met an inspector that won't accomodate a request for getting your boat weighed or any check for that matter. You do have to realize though that they are very busy at a championship race and timing is everything. If you handle the situation properly, it is never an issue.

Steve Roskowski

[Brian10s]

For all those questions . . .

Jack is correct, the rule to be voted on is in regards to when the "official" scales open at ONLY a Divisionals or Nationals. That being said, this rule was proposed by the same volunteers inspectors that are forced to be in inspection, ready to go, long before the rest of us are even out of bed or had our first cup of coffee.

Lets look at a typical day for a "volunteer" inspector at a Divisionals or Nationals. If racing is scheduled to start at 9am, the Inspector must be in Inspection around 6-6:30 to get everything set up. Because while the scales only need to be open, the fuel meters also need to be turned on and calabrated plus the height guages laid out, etc . . . Then they will work all day doing their thing and at a Divisionals or Nationals will still be in Inspection tearing into motors long after most drivers have called it Miller time. At many Nationals, I have taken whatever dinner was served that night down to Inspection because they are still there. And yes, many Nationals Inspectors do nto get to go to the evening activities at Nationals because they are still working when the fun starts.

Also, the race officials are not required to be there, this requirement is just for the Inspectors. Do we expect the Referree and Chief Scorer to be on the Judges Stand 2 hrs before the first green flag? What about Turn boat drivers? Should they be in the boats ont he water 2 hrs before the green?

Seriously, Inspectors are hard to come by to begin with and Divisional and Nationals caliber Inspectors have devoted years to get that type of respect and knowledge. When they ask for a little something back, like an hour, the last thing we should do is confuse the issue with wither the scales need to be certifed or assuming the entire race committee is ready for work when the Inspectors start. And remember, at a Nationals, they show up early all 7 days, not just the first.

[reed28n]

Volunteers

The requirement to have a certified scales at Divisionals and Nationals has been on the books for a very long time. The only change in the ballot item is the time the scales are to be available prior to the start of racing. Bear in mind that the proposal is for Stock only as the Mods have a different cert. requirement. My comment on the proposal is that having someone at the course 2 hrs before the start is good. By keeping this requirement, race officials will be there early and perhaps lead to starting on time which in my experience would be a welcome change. A volunteer is not a necessity.

Jack... while I agree that it does not have to be a volunteer it always is. To pay someone would be an added tax on our racer supported sport. As Steve has pointed out not everyone races at the same time. Typically folks will scale their equipment on test day. One hour is plenty for a man as organized as you. And the Mod category, because of the way their rules are written has already adopted this rule.

We want to be consistant in this case and it was a request from a volunteer that does sit at inspection 2 hours before the race with no one in attendance during a week long event.

Please vote to pass this

[reed28n]

Certified

Mr. Skoontz,

We did have a scale that would not certify at Whitney point one year and we could not use it.

I can't argue the red tape but in New York the County Weights and measures will come and certify our scales at no cost. We just make an appointment with them.

With all of the moving of scales in the back of a trailer and in the back of a trailer, moisture exposure and boats rocked and dropped on our scales.......I kind of like the fact they we checked for accuracy before I hoist my butt up there.

two cents

[Brian10s]

[QUOTE=ricochet112;101505]
All a no vote will do is make the inspector "HAVE" to be at the open scales 2 hours before the event, instead of 1 hour before the event. QUOTE]

Not to mention how "PLEASED" our Divisionals and Nationals Inspectors will be after we the drivers vote down this small request.

A Yes vote is a vote for Happy Inspectors

[Dave M]

Easy There

Darren, don't jump so quick dang man. We need to get you to a Midwest race for some real beer drinking after racing is done so we can all chill out.

As for the rule, the last time a race actually started on time at a Nationals event was... well I can't remember. Fred Miller might be the only one to pull that off. When he said racing begins at 7:30 AM he meant it and the green flag flew whether you were there or not.

Truthfully I think most inspectors are at the race course a couple hours before anything is gonna happen anyways, and I bet they would be happy to get the scales set up for any special requests. After all, they are there for the love of the sport, same as us.

[Jack Stotts]

Dave, just a reminder that we started on time at the last Mod Nationals in Zanesville. Just thought I had better bring that out. Jack

[Kev43V]

I am going to throw out a hypothetical situation as food for thought. I am not implying that this WOULD happen, just that it could happen.
If the scales did not have to be certified. you could make them read almost what you want. You are heavy? your boats heavy? just change the scale to read what you want. then everyone else would have to add weight to reach YOUR weight. does that sound fair ?. or want to set a new record at your race course? just make the scales read heavy everyone could then shed the weight to "new" scale weight. ah heck lets just shed 30 pounds from the boats. do you think we could set new records then? I do
I can see it now, Lake X is the fastest water in the world! Well not really they just have the scale set to read 35 pounds heavy.

[Joe J]

Bill:

As an inspector, I can tell you that I think this is a great idea. As others have said, why should I have to be at the lake 2 hours early?

All of our workers are VOLUNTEERS, and without them, we would all be sitting on the beach..............

Joe

[Big Don]

Drop the arguments about them being certified.....that is not what we are voting for.

It's so our volunteers are not being forced to get up at 5:30AM to get there by 6:15 so they are ready 2 hours early then sitting there for an hour and a half with one person showing up that early to weigh.

Vote YES!!!!!!