2009 APBA Winter Nationals Coverage

[sponsonhead]

For those who don't know.....Rule 8 section 6 in the APBA rule book states that any driver that refuses inspection at a Divisional, National or record-attempt regatta, said driver shall be suspended for a period of one year for unsportsmanlike conduct.
4-J did not show up at inspection. The referee decided to issue a red card instead of implementing the automatic one year suspension (a much lesser penality). The red card was appealed and removed by the race committee.
Tom Johnston
inspector

Being a Referee is a thankless job, and I am not going to throw Ed under the bus. There are a precious few of us out there willing to do this job, and it's not a popularity contest. That said, the wording of the rules on that would cover this situation are ambiguous at best.

My only question that I have over this particular situation is that if the Referee opted for the Red Card as an alternative to implementing the automatic suspension, couldn't he just as easily opted for a Yellow Card? Sends the same message ('you screwed up, don't do it again') with a far less serious ramification to the person who committed the infraction.

R-19

[MGallagher]

Didi he not show up at all or just after the last heat. Also, what has been done in the past is usually an announcement over the PA for the driver to report to inspection immediately with or without his/her boat to receive his/her penalty or reprimand by the inspector and/or referee. Now I'm sure I'll get one of those "we don't need to hold your hand" or "babysit" comments on this, but I think it sounds reasonable to first issue a "yellow card" type warning before going all Kyoti like and beaching the driver for a year.

Hopefully all this was to do is to warn us drivers that something like this can and will happen in the future and not really to actually throw out a member of one of the most influential families(I know there is a lot of other families) in boat racing within the past 40 years.

[Dave M]

Lonnie

HA dave it sounds like you are starting a littel comp between apba an nbra guys too bad some of the fast guys from apba were not there owell maybe next time see ya

Nope, not starting anything. Just thanking the NBRA guys for going to an APBA race basically, and acknowledging the fact they won a lot. Lets hope some of the APBA guys return the favor for once.

[Dave M]

Nice Try

Matt, Dave,
If you guys go through your rule books and point out some of these senseless rules, I'd be glad to propose eliminating them to the Stock & Mod commissions. While you're at it, could you also cross-reference category racing and safety rules with General racing and safety rules and list the rules that could be eliminated due to duplication or superceding criteria? That would be a great help and a good first step in solving this problem. Thanks, John

I would not even begin to try and put common sense back into the rule book...... not one suggestion would pass to eliminating a rule. Perhaps what you said in your message is clear enough ? Superceed, cross reference, etc..... see what I mean...

[Matt Dagostino]

Johnny...................

I would not even begin to try and put common sense back into the rule book...... not one suggestion would pass to eliminating a rule. Perhaps what you said in your message is clear enough ? Superceed, cross reference, etc..... see what I mean...

Dave is right. Once these senseless rules get in the book it takes an act of congress to get them out!!

You make a good point that we have a bunch of overlapping rules throughout the rulebook. I thought that's why we have lawyers and versed commissioners throughout the ranks of APBA to keep our house in order!

Maybe you, i and Ryan should sit down at Millville and re-write the rule book!!

[csh2z]

Actually guys, eliminating a bad or obselete rule is even less difficult than approving new rules. It's the same procedure. The point I'm trying to make is, it's easier to sit back and complain than it is to help to do something about it. My time is just as valuable as yours, but if I want to see something change I've always felt that I better be willing to work for it. Maybe next year I'll not spend my money and limited vacation time to go to the National Meeting ( that may make a lot of people very happy).

[H20racer]

I would hope that the NBRA guys finished first and second in 850 mh because they were the only two with 850 motors out there.

[David_L6]

APBA guys.....NBRA guys........ I don't like the sound of that.

I know there are exceptions (hard heads if you ask me) that will only race in one organization but for the most part we are boat racers. Not AOF boat racers, APBA boat racers, NBRA boat racers. Just boat racers.

[srunne]

I would like to know why 4-J was issued a Red card for not going to inspection and when others didn't go, they were called over the PA to come to inspection??

P.S. I am not throwing anyone under the bus, because I do appreciate what everyone does for racing, I myself I'm involved in our Region and I know what it takes to put on a race. But I want us all to play on the same level playing field and leave our own personal agendas out of it.

[srunne]

Congratulations to Dylan for his JR record at the Winter Nationals. Engine built by his dad.

[Robert M Keogler]

All in all I would say that the Winternationals went very well. Being a observer from a very good vantage point I believe there were mistakes made by race officals as well as racers. Being an old racer
I saw some things I did not understand.
Why, was the rescueboat not close to the first turn at the beginning of each race?
Why was the J race not stopped or red flagged when a j driver fell out of the boat? (I dont believe it was the last lap.)
Wheels need to be removed from engines before you rope them over. Even if the plugs are removed, Dont they?
The rulebook does need to be simplified, so that it does not need to be interpreted.
And just a suggestion, I beleive that you need to find ways to correct infractions, so that you do not thin out the ranks of boat racers any more then they are already.
My wife and I enjoyed being with many of my old friends, and I still beleive Boat Racers are the best people to be around.

[Steve Johnson]

Amen

APBA guys.....NBRA guys........ I don't like the sound of that.

I know there are exceptions (hard heads if you ask me) that will only race in one organization but for the most part we are boat racers. Not AOF boat racers, APBA boat racers, NBRA boat racers. Just boat racers.

Well said and nuff said. Very sad to not make this one.

[Kev43V]

Dave is right. Once these senseless rules get in the book it takes an act of congress to get them out!!

You make a good point that we have a bunch of overlapping rules throughout the rulebook. I thought that's why we have lawyers and versed commissioners throughout the ranks of APBA to keep our house in order!

Maybe you, i and Ryan should sit down at Millville and re-write the rule book!!

At least in this case (apba rules)WE ARE THE CONGRESS! if it is truly a useless or harmfull rule WE can get it removed. just speak up in the proper format to the proper people and get it changed!
Bill B put it very well about WHY such a rule exists.
The most important thing is that the race comittee did over turn the ruling.
so that tells me that while the system is not perfect it still functions.
I am not sure why the ref. chose that penalty, so I will not even begin to speculate as to why.

maybe the best thing is to not let probationary motors compete in nationals?
(this is a question! not a statement of fact)
should the 13th place legal motor miss the finals due to a probie motor that will not get points?

[bill boyes]

KEV, The Race Committee CANNOT over turn a Referee's decision. An appeal can be made to the Referee. I was not there so other than that I will leave it at that.

[Kev43V]

KEV, The Race Committee CANNOT over turn a Referee's decision. An appeal can be made to the Referee. I was not there so other than that I will leave it at that.

quote from Eds post:
"Those are the reasons I did what I did. The driver of the 4-J appealed my decision to the Race Committee which is what the Yellow/Red Card Rule provides. I explained my ruling to the Race Committee during their meeting and then left the meeting. I was later advised that the Race Committee had overturned my ruling."