DSH at Grass Lake

[reed28n]

Systemic Issue

We have way too many rules that we try to get our volunteers to enforce at weekend races. It is a very tricky balance when we get to the Nationals.

We have huge support by the membership every year to implement new rules for one thing or another. It is frequently the result of one exception or particular incident that our loyal volunteers could not resolve at a local event through the use of exisiting rules.

Where is the line drawn. If you cannot meet the rules as written then by our own rules an action must be taken. But there are protests and appeals rules to help drivers take another step. Sometimes in racing it is just tough luck. (I have experienced many)

So, before the national meeting this year I encourage everyone to take a look at our current rules. What can we eliminate in the name of offering our volunteers a bit of relief and make our rules easier to understand.

We do not need more or new rules. We need well known easily understood rules that are easily enforceable.

PS - Dave it was great to see you in Grass Lake

[mercguy]

Protest it Dave!!! Even if I have to return my 5th place trophy....

[daveracerdsh]

Dsh

One kinda funny thing happened heat one DSH finals...I was on the outside of Fred Hauenstein for three laps....he kept pushing me farther and farther out until we were BOTH pushing reeds out of the way...I came into inspection laughing my azz off at the reeds stuck inside my windshield and all over my lifejacket. I owe you one Fred....lmao.

[bill boyes]

No offense intended towards Dave I think he knows it is his boat I respect and fear most.

Those who know me know that I am referencing my own similar nationals experience in that a non performance detail left me disqualified and many shaking there heads.

Dale if you are taking about Oroville your were DQ in a Elim for illegal Numbers. No black background with white numbers. the thing is you should have been advised during boat safety inspection before your heats.

[BP125V]

So, how did the ASH contraversy come out. I heard the DQ on the 2nd heat 1st turn and the sponson tip radius was overturned. Did it grow in the humidity..... ha

No they did not grow, even though it was pretty humid yesterday Matt protested the DQ for the pickle forks and the SORC over turned the DQ.

[bill van steenwyk]

Sorry to hear this happened................

......especially if the hole in question was filled with wires, cables, etc., to enable to allow a starter electrical power to operate, and would not be able to provide additional air for a power boost or increase. This is where you always hope, as Yellowjacket indicated in his post, that common sense would apply, especially if as indicated by another poster, that "even without a cowling no power increase happens" (or similar meaning).

It would be especially onerous, as another poster indicated, if this were a result of discrimination against the Tohatsu of some type. Anyway, as someone who has been on the disqualified end of an inspection decision with no "cheating" intent, you have my sympathy. As also mentioned earlier, these type decisions, with no unfair advantage obvious, are what drive competitors to other categories, or even away from boat racing altogether.

You always hope fellow competitors who were sympathetic and saw someone wronged in this or a similar way might protest by refusing any awards for participation in the same class, but that is sometimes too much to wish for, human nature being what it is.

I am sure you would be welcome in the PRO catgegory. Very simple inspection procedure, bore and stroke, and NORMALLY no agendas. I am sure there is a class you would fit in somewhere.

Good luck with your 302 Stock class Dave.

Bill

[Mike VanAusdle]

Hey Dale, I've been trying to get a hold of you, has your phone # changed? Give me a jingle, 360-477-9121 Thanks dude, Mike.

[daveracerdsh]

Good point

Very good point Yellow.

[Yellowjacket]

In a past life I’ve served on protest committees for the SCCA solo National Championships. These are 800 to 1,000 car week long autocross events and to those of you who aren't familiar with them, understand that to these competitors, this is blood sport.

In many cases the attitude of trying to beat somebody that you couldn’t beat on the track in impound was prevalent. At the same time, there was a saying that “you deserve to be beaten by a legal car” so anybody we crowned a champion should be legal. Protests came to us not only from competitors, but also from the stewards who looked the cars over in impound after running and these guys knew what to look for, and found plenty.

We had to determine, based on a very comprehensive rule book, if a car was illegal. Early on we had one and only one remedy if a car was illegal. That was basically a “death penalty”, the person was gone and that was it. Problem was if we found something that wasn’t quite within the rules, but really resulted in no performance advantage (as this case is a perfect example of), we had no choice but to toss the person. If we allowed any infractions, those became codified in the rules by that action and we couldn’t take them back.

In light of this experience and after a number of years, we finally got the ability to assign penalties for small infractions. Basically we could then say to the competitor, “this isn’t legal” and keep rule creep from happening, but at the same time we could slap the wrist of the person with the infraction and say “if you show up with it this way again you will get tossed” and giving fair warning to the community not to do that again. Most frequently we would impose a penalty of zero seconds preserving the finishing order if the infraction couldn't possibly be a performance advantage. This kept everybody happy (except the guys who wanted to get you DQ’d simply because you beat them).

Sounds like APBA would have come to this kind of conclusion a long time ago and given a the local tech committees the ability to note the infraction, tell everybody that it isn’t legal (which lets others know that it isn’t because if one person is doing it, others probably are too) and still keeps it so that the person isn’t DQ’d for something that it isn’t a performance advantage.

It's not that you want everybody to be happy, because you can't please everybody, but you have to be reasonable and boat racing desperately needs to keep from doing things like this or people will just stop coming to races.

[Turtle]

Who was the inspector? Did someone complain about the size of the air gap? I could see if you enlarged the opening to 2". This seems trivial to me. Hate to hear this stuff.

[Aussie Steve]

^^^^^ Yep true dat Dale !!!

[PRO-MOTIONRACING]

No offense intended towards Dave I think he knows it is his boat I respect and fear most.

Those who know me know that I am referencing my own similar nationals experience in that a non performance detail left me disqualified and many shaking there heads.

[daveracerdsh]

Rule book

Just read Mike's post....I am sure there is no hidden agenda behind this. I do know that some of the people involved to not care for the Tohatsu...but again I am sure there is nothing behind that. Dave

[daveracerdsh]

Dsh

Thanx Steve....of course it was an oversite on my part. [I] do know about the rule pertaining to the belly pan plugs...I was just not aware that they had to stay in place when using electric start. There is no performance advantage to having a very small opening in the pan to my knowledge....and when you walk around the pits you can see people that have taken front Yamato covers and put a 4 inch wide hole over the tickle valve....it is just the way things go I suppose. I am just frustrated beyond belief over the whole thing...but again things happen. See you all at the next race. davey

[hydroman6]

Si do you and peters have been running illegal equulment fir how long? Will the two of you you have to fux it or di you just keep running local races with illegal equioment? Just wondering.

Dave, I didn't post this quote. This is the secong time a post has shown up with my info attached. I would never make a wise crack a a time like this. I've known you for a long time and know this was an oversight. Hope to see you at Lawerance.